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Thread: Time to choose sides?

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  1. Time to choose sides? 
    #1
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    Since its inception in 1948, the Flagship of the welfare state, the NHS has remained true to its founding principles – free for all at the point of delivery irrespective of income or lifestyle.

    Well, that was true up until now anyway. Under the captaincy of the coalition, the NHS is leaving its normal shipping lane and is entering uncharted waters.

    Under government reforms unaccountable appointed Clinical Commissioning Groups have been set up. Rules laid down by the new (CCG), mean that those needing surgery will first have to satisfy their GP that they have lost weight and attended smoking-cessation courses before they will refer them on to be seen by a surgeon. Patients have been told that they cannot have routine operations until they lose weight and stop smoking.

    This controversy is not new – there have been numerous reports in the past of surgeons refusing to operate on patients until they gave up smoking or lost weight. But what is different here is that these are guidelines being imposed from on high, not an individual surgeon assessing a patient and deeming the risk to be too high to warrant an operation.

    Unlike in the past, the surgeon who would perform the operation and the anesthetist responsible for keeping the patient alive will not be part of the decision-making process.
    Under these guidelines, they don’t even get to clap eyes on the patient, let alone assess them.

    What is really worrying is that this is contrary to National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (Nice) guidelines on treating, for example, arthritis. It clearly states that obesity should not be a barrier to referral for joint replacement surgery, and yet the CCG is doing precisely that.

    I have no doubt that this is more about money than patient welfare. We all know that the NHS is under pressure to make financial savings, and introducing artificial barriers for access to treatments is a fine way of doing it – especially if you can hide behind the cloak of patient welfare.

    It is one of the worst kept secrets that the Tories would like to dismantle the welfare state and this is a very slippery slope the NHS is heading down. The NHS is not there to enforce lifestyle choices or to judge the choices people make about their lives. It’s also not there to pick and choose whom it treats. Which groups will the CCG penalise next as pressure mounts to make savings and reduce waiting lists. What about people who engage in dangerous activities – such as horse riding, rock climbing or motorcycle track days for example? Shall we restrict the treatments they can receive as well?

    Some may accuse me of scaremongering, but don’t bet against my predictions.
     
     

  2. Re: Time to choose sides? 
    #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by monday21
    Some may accuse me of scaremongering, but don’t bet against my predictions.
    I would
    G
     
     

  3. Re: Time to choose sides? 
    #3
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    Time will tell Gerry, not sure about the horse riding thing though because of ballot box reprisals.

    Whether or not people going off in to the mountains should make provision for their own insurance to cover medical treatment in the unforunate event of an accident, is already under discussion.

    We live in times when everyone is pointing the blame and different groups in society are attacking each other. Sadly, minority groups like bikers are soft targets.
     
     

  4. Re: Time to choose sides? 
    #4
    Platinum Member Goldie's Avatar
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    The beginning of the end, IMHO > we are on the slippery slope to anti-collectivism :-/
    In loving memory of Mikkie Mahon 8th May 1986 - 28th September 2014. Taken too soon, ride free x
    “I WILL be a story in your head, but that’s ok. We are all stories in the end, just make yours a good one, eh?”
     
     

  5. Re: Time to choose sides? 
    #5
    Senior Member Senna(Dan)'s Avatar
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    All politicians are the same and just want to pull the wool over eyes.
    They will keep raising taxes, making cuts that screw everybody but themselves over and enjoying lots of 'perks' courtesy of the tax payer.
    People are more violently opposed to fur than leather because it's safer to harass rich women than motorcycle gangs.


    http://tbex.co.uk/
     
     

  6. Re: Time to choose sides? 
    #6
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    I do question where the money goes, for example - the NHS is always making cuts and constantly delivering a poor service.....

    But at my local hospital (RUH) theyve got a really pretty atrium. Why was it necessary? And how much did it cost? :
     
     

  7. Re: Time to choose sides? 
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    I failed to mention in my earlier post that denying patients who smoke routine operations will only encourage them to lie about their daily intake of nicotine - even the numbskulls who drafted up these reforms must have seen the implications before they rubber-stamped the bill.

    I couldn’t help but notice that the obese and smokers, but not those with alcohol dependency problems are being discriminated against for NHS treatment.

    Probably because the lawmakers must have been p*ssed-up in the commons bar courtesy of the taxpayer, when they drafted up this ridiculous bill.
     
     

  8. Re: Time to choose sides? 
    #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by monday21
    I failed to mention in my earlier post that denying patients who smoke routine operations will only encourage them to lie about their daily intake of nicotine - even the numbskulls who drafted up these reforms must have seen the implications before they rubber-stamped the bill.

    I couldn’t help but notice that the obese and smokers, but not those with alcohol dependency problems are being discriminated against for NHS treatment.

    Probably because the lawmakers must have been p*ssed-up in the commons bar courtesy of the taxpayer, when they drafted up this ridiculous bill.
    There are tests that are used to tell if you're still smoking or not and can also be quite accurate on the amount you smoke. These are used in the sponsored councelling and support programmes which are jointly funded PCT (NHS if you like) and the County Councils. As there's a high cost to this 1-1 counselling service on quiting smoking all the candidates take one of these tests at each appointment otherwise they lose the financial support they're getting to help them quit. Seems fair to me.
     
     

  9. Re: Time to choose sides? 
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    Oh I see Graeme. The Clinical Commissioning Groups will insist that all local GPs test smokers waiting for an op before a referral is made to a surgeon.Hmmm :-/

    Beginning to understand now why so many GPs are against the reforms
     
     

  10. Re: Time to choose sides? 
    #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by monday21
    Oh I see Graeme. The Clinical Commissioning Groups will insist that all local GPs test smokers waiting for an op before a referral is made to a surgeon.Hmmm :-/

    Beginning to understand now why so many GPs are against the reforms
    No, that's not what I meant Ken. All I was mentioning was that the technology is available for testing smokers to prove if they have quit and if not how much they're still smoking. It was just in referenc eto your comment about them lying about whether they have quit or not. Also, in the service I mentioned, the GP's are not in the loop.
     
     

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