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Biggest demo in London for over 8 years yesterday with well over 250 thousand ordinary people taking to the streets. We can fight wars on 3 fronts whilst record youth unemployed home in 'Blighty'. Cuts are too severe - ignore the mood of the nation at your peril Libcons! Power to the people.
>:( >:( >:(
I have to say I voted for Conservatives, and to be honest something had to be done, Labour would leave it longer to sort the problem and after their mammoth spending spree the last four years to try to buy votes do you honestly think they would have done any better?!
This is one of those situations where things are going to get worse before they get better, WHOEVER is in Govt, and no amount of people on marches will change their minds either.
Taken from Full Metal Jacket
Quote:
"it's a huge **** sandwich, and we're all gonna have to take a bite"
Dave, people taking to the streets over the unpopular 'Poll Tax' ended the reign of the 'Iron Lady' [smiley=thumbsup.gif]Quote:
Originally Posted by noisy_lightning
Taken from Full Metal Jacket
[/quote]Quote:
"it's a huge **** sandwich, and we're all gonna have to take a bite"
None for me thanks, i've already eaten ;)
Yep I enjoyed the day, it is good to voice your frustration, I've not had this sort of a vibe about people hating the government since the days of Maggie. In my humble opinion there is a lot more than public sector cuts they could do to claw money back.
Dave, people taking to the streets over the unpopular 'Poll Tax' ended the reign of the 'Iron Lady' [smiley=thumbsup.gif][/quote]Quote:
Originally Posted by monday21
I like it as little as the next person, but been in the Armed Forces am not allowed to voice such opinions. I am subject to the two year pay freeze that everyone else in the public sector is on as well, along with all the cuts etc its not a secure job at the moment and we are just waiting to see which trades are going to be hit.
What though is the alternative? If they hit the banks they will leave the UK for another country who wont tax them to high hell, if they hit the wealthy they will up sticks and move to another country also. If Labour had not sold everything they owned over the last decade we wouldnt be so badly off now, gold reserves been a perfect example.
Only thing I can think of is stop the massive contributions to the EU, stop giving other countries aid when they dont need it (India has a damn space program and we are funding them still, same with China!) and get a damn grip on the state spongers who are raping the welfare system. But lets be realistic though, the amount of Civil Servants who do absolutely NOTHING and get paid healthy for it is shocking, yes its bad they are hitting the public sector, but if my experience of some of the jobs is to go by then they need not have the job there at all considering what they actually achieve!
Vote Hunar
FJ, did you attend the demo, I intended to go, but I had to work at the last moment. If you are going on the next one give me a shout - perhaps we could go together on our bikes. My daughter left school with 4 A levels nearly a year ago and she is still unemployed. She has applied for many jobs, but prospective employers keep telling her she is over qualified. My Dad is dying and the care he has received is nothing short of a bloody disgrace. I am sick and tired of being told, “We are all in this together.” Why should the ordinary person sit back and take it on the chin while the Energy suppliers, Bankers, Oil Companies’ etc keep raking in obscene profits.Quote:
Originally Posted by FJ_Biker
redken1 wrote
Ken I went to the demo, the union in work kindly provided free transport from Swindon. I feel sorry for young people trying to get work and like you have suffered trying to get decent care for family members it is a disgrace they spend all their lives working for this country to get treated like this.Quote:
FJ, did you attend the demo, I intended to go, but I had to work at the last moment. If you are going on the next one give me a shout - perhaps we could go together on our bikes. My daughter left school with 4 A levels nearly a year ago and she is still unemployed. She has applied for many jobs, but prospective employers keep telling her she is over qualified. My Dad is dying and the care he has received is nothing short of a bloody disgrace. I am sick and tired of being told, “We are all in this together.” Why should the ordinary person sit back and take it on the chin while the Energy suppliers, Bankers, Oil Companies’ etc keep raking in obscene profits.
I will let you know when the next march is, I am thinking of doing one of the occupations for a while now one Saturday from this site http://www.ukuncut.org.uk/ I am just getting hacked off with big business not paying its fair share of tax if interested please let me know.
Thanks Taff
Ten year's ago my work was about 90% UK, 10% overseas. Now it's almost the exact reverse as more and more businesses relocate overseas due to the high UK corporation taxes and high UK wages.
I can move a company's tax domicile in a few days. Nothing changes except the company pays significantly less taxes.
The same goes for the good earners. They don't need to be in the UK paying 60% PAYE & NICs, 20% VAT, 50% Inheritance Tax and so on if they can work in the sun and keep more of their earnings.
Higher taxes does not correct broken finances. Never has, never will.
Now show me the way to the protests outside Brown's house and I'll be there. Against all advice and in the face of centuries of clear cyclical / inflationary cycles this dangerous man knew better and not only sold half our nation's true worth around $275/oz but he made the BOE announce it beforehand. Selling at the bottom of the cycle and announcing it to make sure he got rock bottom price. The sale realised $3.54bn in fiat currency (USD).
Since then USD has devalued to toilet paper and this morning spot gold is $1430/oz - the gold we used to own is now worth $18.4bn.
How many hospitals, schools, jobs would that have built / saved? Where are the protests? Why has he not been thrown in jail?
Maybe it's ok max-ing out the credit card if you have a means of paying it back. The most financially and economically illiterate chancellor this country has ever known had no way of paying off the bills he racked up buying votes. A dangerous man ultimately responsible for costing tens of thousands of jobs in this country. Probably forever.
Just another way of looking at it ;)
I'm all for the demo's by the way. Gives both the people and the police the chance to blow off some steam. Also (as you'll note from previous posts) I am firmly anti-banker etc. I am staggered that not a single banker in either the US or the UK has been thrown in jail for causing the biggest financial collapse in history. When you have a global ponzi scheme protected by politicians nothing will ever change. Demo's are just pissing in the wind so far as that goes.
The problem with making massive cuts is public staffing is that you suddenly make several thousand people unemployed, flooding an already difficult job market with more people, and those people you make redundant you will have to pay redundancy and then pay them in welfare benefits. On the other hand the public purse cannot carry on spending at the rates it is, and needs to cut back on the bulk. The problem is that when the choice comes to who loses their jobs, as far as I can tell it's the people on the highest wages that decide, and they won't make themselves or their well paid mates redundant, so they will make the front line staff redundant first.
Supermarkets like ADSA and Tesco announced record profits, yet they employ the largest percentage of people who require government benefits to top their wages up.
In the 70's and 80's something like 30% of the workforce was employed in manufacturing, now I believe it's less than 10%, possibly as low as 5%. That's because the cost of living in this country is so high, so the cost of the manual workforce is high, in places like India the cost of living is much lower, and so the cost of the workforce is much lower, for the same work. So many companies will move they manufacturing to a cheaper country. Now you still have the same workforce in this country, but less jobs for them to do.
We currently tax business at 20% I believe, Singapore charges 5%, Ireland charges 12.5% if I am correct, so all the buinesses that earn the big money offshore their funds to avoid tax, and run it all through places like Singapore. If we reduce the TAX bill, then they will move more or all of their money back into this country, so we will end up getting more than we do at the moment in tax. As for the wealthy people, well I am sure there are ways that you can tighen up the system to ensure they cannot avoid paying their fair share of TAX. I saw a story the other day that claimed someone earning £300k per year can pay less tax than someone earning £50k, shocking init!
No doubt there are tough choices to be made, there is a large debt to be paid off, and we are all in it together, it's just that some have to swim, others have boats, and it's the ones with the boats that make the choices on how much swimming everyone else has to do, they can off course get rid of their boats and swim with everyone else, but that would ruin the saville row suit....
Vote Hunar, **** 'em!
Banks? Scum.
Chappers for Chancellor as far as I'm concerned :)
Chappers, of course you are right about the global economy-I accept that it is difficult for our government to regulate banks unilaterally, but it is not just the citizens of the UK who have finally woken-up to the banking fiasco.
As taxpayers we are stakeholders in the banks to the tune of approx £38 billion, so surely it is reasonable for the ordinary person to expect some form of protection to his/her investment.
With the greatest respect, I don’t attend protests just to “Blow of Steam” and I have never been a member of the “Pissing in the wind” defeatist club. History tells me that the working man was never gifted anything from the ruling class – the masses had to fight for it ‘tooth and nail’.
On a Friday evening some twenty years ago, I was in my local pub relaxing before the following day’s anti-Poll Tax demo in Glasgow. Whilst enjoying my pint, I was accosted by an inebriated patron who informed me, that we the protesters were, “Pissing in the wind.”
Never saw the chap in question again, but two years on I was in the same pub enjoying a double celebration. I felt a part of the long hard campaign which not only brought about the demise of the unfair Poll Tax, but ultimately led to the toppling of Prime Minister Thatcher.
The resolve of the protesters who attended last Saturday’s demo in London reminded me of the anti-Poll Tax marches. Like thousands if not millions of other ordinary people, I am ready for a fight and to piss in the wind – "The wind of change."
[smiley=thumbsup.gif]
Not disagreeing with your right to be angry RK, quite the opposite. People need to fight, but my observation is that ultimately little changes. The rich have controlled the poor since the dawn of time. Wealth doesn't disappear, it just flows from one pocket to another.
The poll tax riots you mention are probably a good illustration of this. What really changed from a taxation perspective when the poll tax was replaced? A disproportionate tax on the lowest earners was simply spread out by successive Conservative and Labout governments to higher council tax, higher VAT, VAT on energy, higher NICs, lower nil rate bands and dozens of other, mainly indirect, taxes, that disproportionately tax the lower earners in society. A classic pyrrhic victory.
Re being stakeholders in the banks, the taxpayer/ BOE will make a profit on the sale of the stakes. They have guaranteed it by inflating away the debt with ZIRP and QE. That's just another way of sh1tting on the poor - the resulting food inflation being the reason the AMEA riots started in the first place. Over 14% of the US population are on food stamps now. Incredible mess Brown and Bernanke have got us all into.
Right better get on and finish some work. >:(
Enjoyed our engagement Chappers (in a platonic way of course). I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment, but as a socialist I can’t accept it (better not get in to that though). I just wish that people were more important than profit. Look forward to meeting you on a ride in the future, or perhaps you may like to join me on a bank sit-in. ;D
strictly online banking for me ken ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by monday21
yep, be good to meet you one day. no talking politics or religion though ... ;D