Remember the insurance.

[Jon_W]

As a reminder the DVLA will be able to do you for having a vehicle taxed but not insured as of the end of the month.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-13493056

Yet another way to get a bit of extra dosh!

[Nelly]

ker-ching!

[Blackandchrome]

Only if you fail to declare SORN!
What's the problem? :(
Any person who has vehicle insurance is paying an excess due to those that are uninsured! >:(
I pay my premiums and remain legal- 100%
So why can't all other owners ?
Perhaps those that have suffered as a result of being "involved" with an uninsured vehicle owner will be very much for this new law. ;)

[Hazel-nut]

so does that mean if you have your car parked on your drive (which im assuming is private land) then you can get a fine for not having it insured?

[igbell]

Yes if it is not SORN...

[Hazel-nut]

thats ridiculous! if you arent driving it then you arent gonna crash it are you! i think my car was left uninsured for a few days last year as it ran out while we were on holiday and i couldnt afford it before the holiday as i got paid part way through the holiday as well! i wasnt driving it and it was parked on a drive so it wasnt doing anyone any harm! what a stupid idea!!!

[igbell]

In one way it is stupid but then when my Dad was alive he had lovley Vauxhall Senator that used to be the mayor of readings so it was a great car, but some silly sod drove into the back of him and wrote it off, and guess what the silly little kid in his XR3i had no insurance....

[NoYou]

thats ridiculous! if you arent driving it then you arent gonna crash it are you! i think my car was left uninsured for a few days last year as it ran out while we were on holiday and i couldnt afford it before the holiday as i got paid part way through the holiday as well! i wasnt driving it and it was parked on a drive so it wasnt doing anyone any harm! what a stupid idea!!!
Assuming the government haven't done their usual and passed the law without thinking ahead, then i would imagine there is a lee way in the law, probably the same amount of time you have after you road tax expires to declare the vehicle SCORN, to allow for situations like this and if not you would be able to appeal against that sort of thing because of the circumstances.
Personally i think this is a good change provided they do it properly, with less uninsured drivers on the roads everyones insurance SHOULD (but probably won't...) go down, or at the least not go up any more.
Geo

[Dennis_Sinanan]

There is another side to this that is causing me grief at the moment. I have my wife's scooter currently on SORN ( with no insurance) as it has been sat in the garage since last year. However I would like to put it up for sale and would like to offer it with 12 months TAX (so the new owner can pay and drive away with their insurance), but to do that I would have to insure the bike (even though it is staying in the garage) and keep it insured. Now Tax for a year on the scooter is 15 quid and insurance for the year is 80 quid. If someone buys the bike quickly they will get to use the tax, but the insurance will go totally unused and the company will take a hefty fee to cancel the policy early.

Any suggestions on (legal) ways around this?

Also anybody want a 2009 Yamaha Xc125 Scooter?? ;D ;D

[Blackandchrome]

"thats ridiculous! if you arent driving it then you arent gonna crash it are you! i think my car was left uninsured for a few days last year as it ran out while we were on holiday and i couldnt afford it before the holiday as i got paid part way through the holiday as well! i wasnt driving it and it was parked on a drive so it wasnt doing anyone any harm! what a stupid idea!!! "
Rather a naive attitude! :P
So when your away on your holiday and your car gets nicked or vandalised? ::)
Who is gonna wish that they had insurance? ;)

[Ryan]

Why dont they just randomly fine people for the sake of it, thats what they will be doing soon ::)

[Blackandchrome]

Hey Dennis.
You can still offer the scoot with 12 months road tax, on agreement of sale.
New owner can go away and sort out the insurance whilst you take scoot off SORN.(And make sure the cheque clears ;))
New owner pitches up a few days later with legal insurance and you have a taxed scoot raring to go!
Hopefully everyone is happy and no law is broken.
Not bad for a tractordriver eh? ;D

[Col]

Guys I am certain it don't work like that :(

If the scoot has no MOT then it can't be insured and if it is insured then it is invalidated because of no mot plus without insurance or mot it can't be taxed. The new owner would have to trailer away. However if it is new[ish] and requires no mot then to get tax isn't going to be a prob as already insured. There is a window whereby if a vehicle is actually booked into a garage it can be taken straight there to get an mot in order to obtain road fund licence.

Bear in mind,at all times, that law is made by politicians which easily explains why, very often, it makes no logical or common sense and is frequently tested in courts by overpaid legal wafflers ::)

Happy to be corrected but that is how I understand the tosh.

On topic - It's a good thing and if a vehicle is SORN and off the road then you don't insure it and won't be fined if plod asks. Plenty of uninsured vehicles littering the side streets these days.

[Ducatista]

if you arent driving it then you arent gonna crash it are you!

It could catch fire, or roll down the drive.

Also a thief could take it and crash it.
If the thief is unknown then the MIB (motorists insurers beureaux) will pick up the case.
If the thief is known then believe it on not YOUR INSURANCE will have to fork out. This is a legal obligation under the Road Traffic act. If the person is unemployed it may not be possible to recoup the costs from them.

So yes, you car can still cause problems for innocent people even if you are not driving it.

It's unfair if your insurance has to pay for something you didn't do, but it's about protecting innocent people from your car, not necessarily from you driving it.

[Squashed_Fly]

Ref the scooter - just take the amount of 12 months tax off the sale price and let the new buyer tax it when he's insured it.

Job done

[Dennis_Sinanan]

Hey Dennis.
You can still offer the scoot with 12 months road tax, on agreement of sale.
New owner can go away and sort out the insurance whilst you take scoot off SORN.(And make sure the cheque clears ;))
New owner pitches up a few days later with legal insurance and you have a taxed scoot raring to go!
Hopefully everyone is happy and no law is broken.
Not bad for a tractordriver eh? ;D

Not bad for a tractor driver at all :) thanks, always a good option.
Thanks to Squashed_Fly as well.

Sorry for straying off topic, I will leave it there and offer the scooter with out tax.

[redken1]

Perhaps someone could explain, but I fail to see how this new legislation will deter those road users who drive/ride on public roads without insurance. Surely they will just declare SORN and continue as before? Or am I just not getting it?

[NoYou]

Perhaps someone could explain, but I fail to see how this new legislation will deter those road users who drive/ride on public roads without insurance. Surely they will just declare SORN and continue as before? Or am I just not getting it?
The point of it is that to catch somebody for driving without insurance requires much more work than catching somebody driving a vehicle declared as off the road, to check a vehicles insurance a request has to go to the insurance company they are registered with and also means lots and lots of paperwork whereas a vehicle declared off the road can be detected by those auto scanning cameras in police cars. (Don't quote me on that but I'm fairly sure thats right ;])
Geo

[slowr1der]

Perhaps someone could explain, but I fail to see how this new legislation will deter those road users who drive/ride on public roads without insurance. Surely they will just declare SORN and continue as before? Or am I just not getting it?
The point of it is that to catch somebody for driving without insurance requires much more work than catching somebody driving a vehicle declared as off the road, to check a vehicles insurance a request has to go to the insurance company they are registered with and also means lots and lots of paperwork whereas a vehicle declared off the road can be detected by those auto scanning cameras in police cars. (Don't quote me on that but I'm fairly sure thats right ;])
Geo

A vehicle with no insurance can be detected by ANPR as well, it only then takes a phone call to the insurance company or MIB to confirm the insurance.

I believe this is aimed more at this kind of scenario..........

A family have 2 cars registered in seperate names but only one insurance policy is taken out by the couple for one vehicle. The second vehicle remains at the side of the road uninsured when its not being driven but insured when driven by a person with a fully comp policy that enables them to drive other vehicles.

[Ducatista]

The second vehicle remains at the side of the road uninsured

It's wasn't legal for a car to be on the public road uninsured.
But they could legally have parked the car on their driveway or privately owned car parking space.

[Loops]

A family have 2 cars registered in seperate names but only one insurance policy is taken out by the couple for one vehicle. The second vehicle remains at the side of the road uninsured when its not being driven but insured when driven by a person with a fully comp policy that enables them to drive other vehicles.


That also won't work, as almost all policies which allow driving other cars state that the other vehicle must be insured itself.

So I also fail to see who this will catch except the most stupid of criminals who don't just declare the car SORN, and the unfortunate motorist who has (for example) put the car in for MOT, it failed and they're fixing it, but at the same time the insurance ran out.
So they now have to send in the paperwork to declare it SORN (which as we know could takes weeks), and then possibly only a very short while later, get it re-taxed...!

[jpssantos]

There is another side to this that is causing me grief at the moment. I have my wife's scooter currently on SORN ( with no insurance) as it has been sat in the garage since last year. However I would like to put it up for sale and would like to offer it with 12 months TAX (so the new owner can pay and drive away with their insurance), but to do that I would have to insure the bike (even though it is staying in the garage) and keep it insured. Now Tax for a year on the scooter is 15 quid and insurance for the year is 80 quid. If someone buys the bike quickly they will get to use the tax, but the insurance will go totally unused and the company will take a hefty fee to cancel the policy early.

Any suggestions on (legal) ways around this?

Also anybody want a 2009 Yamaha Xc125 Scooter?? ;D ;D

errm.... dont you need to show proof of insurance to tax a vehicle? (and MOT)

[Taylor911]

This is crap...

I hope to pass my driving test soon, so to save un-needed provisional insurance ill cancel it until i can afford the rise in full license insurance.

Which wont be easy...

So ill end up being penalised for my car not being used because of passing my test...

Thanks DVLA.....

[jpssantos]

Perhaps someone could explain, but I fail to see how this new legislation will deter those road users who drive/ride on public roads without insurance. Surely they will just declare SORN and continue as before? Or am I just not getting it?
The point of it is that to catch somebody for driving without insurance requires much more work than catching somebody driving a vehicle declared as off the road, to check a vehicles insurance a request has to go to the insurance company they are registered with and also means lots and lots of paperwork whereas a vehicle declared off the road can be detected by those auto scanning cameras in police cars. (Don't quote me on that but I'm fairly sure thats right ;])
Geo

A vehicle with no insurance can be detected by ANPR as well, it only then takes a phone call to the insurance company or MIB to confirm the insurance.

I believe this is aimed more at this kind of scenario..........

A family have 2 cars registered in seperate names but only one insurance policy is taken out by the couple for one vehicle. The second vehicle remains at the side of the road uninsured when its not being driven but insured when driven by a person with a fully comp policy that enables them to drive other vehicles.






i think what you are saying only works if the other vehicle is insured.
for example, your mate is drunk you take his car from the pub, you insurance covers you driving your mates car as long as its insured.

if your mate car doesnt have insurance, then it wont work.

or else everyone would be getting insurance on a 1.0 Micra... and buying a 3L turbo to drive around...

[bobf279]

This is crap...

So ill end up being penalised for my car not being used because of passing my test...

Not if you declare the car SORN you won't

[jpssantos]

Also, if you declare SORN and there's still tax left, dont they give you the remaining months money back?

[Ryan]

Yes they do

[jpssantos]

So... I dont see the problem, think its a good thing, just another way of trying to stop people driving without insurance.

doesnt make any harm to the good citizen......
even that bit of insurance about to run out, i bet its like the tax, you have 14 days after it expires, to tax again, you'll be done if you drive it on the roads with expired tax, but you have 14 days to tax.

[Scotty]

Also, if you declare SORN and there's still tax left, dont they give you the remaining months money back?
They do refund the remaining Vehicle Excise Duty (tax) but ONLY if you return the tax disc to them along with the appropriate form from the Post Office (may be able to download it nowadays), correctly filled in and sent before the end of the month.
I'm not even sure if the 14 days' grace on expired VED remains as everyone gets a reminder a month before expiry nowadays, and you don't need to queue in the Post Office any more, just do it on-line.

There is however NO GRACE PERIOD AT ALL on insurance - when it expires, you are uninsured, end of.

[jpssantos]

yeh, you still get the 14days, as I called DVLA not long ago asking about that

So what you are saying is that if your insurance expires on the 31st of May, but you only renew the insurance on the 2nd of June, you'll get a fine (or whatever is) through the post at some point?