View Full Version : EU making it harder to get a licence
Your view...
This has been stirring around sometime, but now it appears even in the face of stiff opposition from motorcycling organisations and manufacturers this will be going through.
The EU commission has ruled that there will be a new agreement which will affect your ability to obtain a motorcycle licence :'(
- Minimum age for riding over 125cc rises to 19
- Direct access not allowed on large capacity bikes (over 47hp) until you are 24
- New categories of licence created that create steps between capacities on bikes
- If you are under 24 you will need to complete staged tests to get onto a larger bike
Personally I think this is a major blow to the motorcycling industry and goes no way to improving safety on the roads, only reducing the number of riders on them.
The basis for this agreement is flawed, are we are now removing a whole adult age group from being able to buy the bike of their choice....would you agree that someone who is 24 is more capable of riding a large capacity bike, than someone who is 21?....i am 27 BTW :(
http://www.biker247.com/news/5371.asp
I suggest if you want a good read of this you pick up this weeks copy of MCN...also got a free Demon Tweeks catalogue ;)
I think the 125cc age should be 17 same as car, and I'd remove the ability to ride a 'ped on L plates, making it compulsory to have a test...afterall you're not allowed to drive a car on L plates without someone else there are you?
the DAS bit...22 is a fair age I think, perhaps though extend the compulsory training. Although I did a crash course myself, I don't think a week is long enough to go from never having ridden to having a licence for big bikes. Around my traiing I'd been riding a 600 for months (private roads of course) which gave me much more experience than I would have got otherwise
JamesHockley
30-03-06, 09:39 AM
What about similar measures for cars?
When you first pass your test you can drive up a 1 litre.
You then have to pass a further test to drive up to a 1.6 litre.
And so on, see how that goes down with the tin top brigade!
!
well insurance usually forces most people to do that anyway with cars..I was stuck with a 1.1 for 3 years until insurance came down, then 1.4 and now 2.0
JamesHockley
30-03-06, 11:44 AM
well insurance usually forces most people to do that anyway with cars..I was stuck with a 1.1 for 3 years until insurance came down, then 1.4 and now 2.0
Thats true, but what you have then is one rule for the those who can afford it and one rule for those who can't. Plus think of the number of young people who drive bigger cars because they insured on there parents insurance.
t's a good point...
not sure what I'd suggest really - having done my DAS when I was 22 I would have been put off biking altogether if I had had to wait until 24. It's the kids driving badly on mopeds and 125s that annoy me - many are allowed on the roads with just a CBT each year which is far from adequate training!
t's a good point...
not sure what I'd suggest really - having done my DAS when I was 22 I would have been put off biking altogether if I had had to wait until 24. It's the kids driving badly on mopeds and 125s that annoy me - many are allowed on the roads with just a CBT each year which is far from adequate training!
That's a very good point, and one that motorcycle manufactures have picked up on, if you don't get early exposure to motorcycling then chances are you may never pick it up.
I agree that the CBT is not a good enough test to show you can ride on the road safely, and mopeds are very dangerous...i would prefer to see a more formal test at this stage, with more controls over the schools that do CBT courses...
On my CBT moons ago the girl I was out with was so pre-occupied with the task of operating the scooter she made a catalogue of mistakes, including driving the wrong way up an exit road of a major A road !! :o
They still gave her a pass though, and she was lethal..... :-/
Definately agree with the idea of doing a full test instead of the CBT. You have no questions about highway code and no real experience on the open road apart from 2 hours which is rubbish.
I did a DAS last June when i was 26. It was my girlfriend that entertained the idea of me getting a bike as i had always um'd and ar'd about it because in my head i could never get past the fact that with 2 tyres only there is much more of a chance that you wont get round the corner.
Now i have a bike i love it and wouldnt trade it for anything.
Back to the subject though, I had 10 years road experience before getting my bike so when i get on it i am learning how to ride the machine not how the road works and that takes plenty of brain power. If you have to learn the road, what other people are most likely going to do and learn how to control the machine i cant see how anyone can really do it.
I think the age to control any machine on the roads should be 17 and you should have to take a full test to drive it.
DAS shouldnt really be allowed unless extensive road sense can be proven as most people can drive something but not many have road sense.
I have a 750 after 9 months and although i love it i think people should have to have something smaller than 80BHP for one year and after that it is yours choice.
I would strongly recommend joining one of the Riders Rights groups. Either MAG or BMF and support them to fight the cause.
We should also as a private individual lobby/write to our MP and/or MEP expressing our concerns over this issue and any other motorcycling issues.
It's good to talk about this amongst ourselves but we really need to get our opinions heard and the only way to do it is to tell those who make the decisions.
Someone give me a hand to get down off the soap box...
defintiely worth campaigning for it BB, otherwise bikers will be even more discriminated against!
JamesHockley
30-03-06, 03:14 PM
How about getting biking recognised as a religion, then it would be illegal to discriminate against us!!
The motorcycle could be religious icon!
How about getting biking recognised as a religion, then it would be illegal to discriminate against us!!
The motorcycle could be religious icon!
I like this ;D
zebedee1984
01-04-06, 01:36 PM
What about similar measures for cars?
When you first pass your test you can drive up a 1 litre.
You then have to pass a further test to drive up to a 1.6 litre.
And so on, see how that goes down with the tin top brigade!
!
I agree that there should be some steps, but also thatcars should be subject to the same restrictions as the risk when crashing a car then falls not only to the person driving but more to the generalpublic as the car is likely to do more damage than a motorcycle.
I did the A2 license and had to wait to proceed up to larger capacity bikes and it saved me from killing myself on something that was far to powerful for my experience. I mean how many people on this site can honestly say they can use (safely) all of the power thier bike has to offer? very few and those that can, probably only can on the track.
my first biggish bike was an FZR 400RR and it made 65hp unrestricted,but even when it was restricted to 33bhp it still beat the arse of most cars and was still fantastic fun to ride.
I don't know however whether there should be compulsory testing at each power level because this will cost anabsolute fortune, which (typical of Labour) means that once again your average Joe won't be able to afford to ride.
I think that the steps should be based on the amount of time you have been riding. and I think that age shouldn't come in to it.
Is a gent of 30 more sensible than a lass of 18? the answers aren't clear cut. the best way is through experience every time!
zebedee1984
01-04-06, 01:38 PM
How about getting biking recognised as a religion, then it would be illegal to discriminate against us!!
The motorcycle could be religious icon!
This is also an excellent idea and I would like to know how I can enter in to this new faith...!
I am now a monk of the motorcyclian religion and you shall call me... phil!
personally, i can only see good things with this as the way i've read it (and other articles on it) it means more training for people before they can jump on 150 bhp bikes, which can only be a good thing surely.
agreed it should be the same for cars as well, but anything that can decrease the amount of unnecessary accidents due to people attempted to ride powerful bikes way too early in their riding career and who basically can't handle or are unable to fully appreciate/utilise the power correctly in these bikes then i fully endorse this venture.
i don't think its a case of making it harder to get a bike license, all it is is preventing people from jumping off their CB500 after their direct access test at the age of 21 and jumping on a ZX10/gixxer thou etc
who would argue with that?
exactly, the more training the better...and I dont think most sensible people would argue - afterall most of us lot are doing bikesafe this year!
Amante_271
06-04-06, 09:19 AM
Amen Brother Phil!
On a separate but related thread, why dont the powers that be make CBT compulsary for car drivers as well as bike riders. Whats the point I hear you cry!
1. Car drivers would respect how bikes work!
2. They wouldnt be such B*stards to us!
3. The "Sorry mate I didnt see you!" excuse would go as they would be much more aware of bikes - I know I am as a car driver!
4. We would get more people interested in bikes/the religion!
BB is SO right about getting in touch with your MP/MEP (providing you know who they are! Do you?) By making our voice heard & not just mumbling and whinging amoungest ourselves, THEY HAVE to act!!! Especially if enough people shout out loud enough!!
BB, thanks for letting me borrow your soap box, you can have it back now. Ive got to get a rub down with a damp edition of the Radio Times now to calm down!!
Ride safe! Ride Free!!
As someone who is taking their CBT next week, I am sure I will not feel safe on the road until I have obtained my full licence. I sat on my partners Blackbird last night - how heavy is that??!! Wan't a good move for my confidence - was convinced I would just fall off and get squashed. I also agree the same thing type of thing should exist for new car drivers. And another thing, those 'P' plates are a stupid idea - you can keep them on as long as you like and it just gives them the right to behave like they are new to driving whilst making everyone else's life a misery on the roads.
Amante_271
06-04-06, 10:26 AM
Good luck with the CBT next week. Bet you fly thru it! Piece of cake sweetheart! :)
zebedee1984
06-04-06, 01:05 PM
yeah, god luck with it, you'll have no problems,just stay relaxed.
just read the new rules in MCN, looks like after 2012 people won't be able to ride restricted until the grand old age of 24!
benobiker
06-04-06, 02:36 PM
I am not sure about this myself. I can see both sides. For me personaly I hopped straight onto an 1100. I had been riding bikes all my life on the farm etc and for me knew if i had a big bike i would respect it more than say an rgv 250 on which i would have surely crashed. I think it would be nice if the government sorry ,,, Nanny left it upto the individual to decide. Its nice to make your own choice. It all seems a bit odd when you can pass your car test and get into any car.
Back on the soap box...
Details of you MP & MEP for Wiltshire can be found at http://www.wiltshire.gov.uk/local-mp-meps-general-information
If you live in a neighbouring County then www.your county name.gov.uk usually finds it.
Details for MAG & the BMF at www.bmf.co.uk and www.mag-uk.org
Did you know the bike tax went up in the budget? Only a quid or two depending on engine size but it is hardly encouraging PTW's :(
too much time on your hands BB
i'm sure there are plenty of people up in arms after the typical weekly wednesday scaremongering MCN supply, but i'm sure all these reforms is to make biking safer.
feel free to correct me if you think i'm wrong in between you emailing BMF of course.
that reminds me, i must right to my local mp about the rise in tax of beer and ciggies
too much time on your hands BB
Huh, if only!
I haven't read MCN to comment on their report - although people have equated them to the motorcycling equivalent to the Sun!
I'm not against reform, I can generally see both sides of the argument, there are good and bad points to both sides. It's like I said somewhere else, it's not the bikes that are dangerous it’s the rider behind the bars. I do feel that if you discourage people enough at whatever age, they won't bother to learn to ride and then we loose the new blood we so desperately need in biking - but obviously don't want to see spilt!
I actually belong to MAG as a full member. I rely on them to fight the corner on motorcycling on my behalf. Of course I don't actually tell them what I want or if I agree with what they do, in fact I don't give them any idea of what I want at all. Pretty bad of me really! But I do know I want to be able to ride my bike and I want others to be able to ride what they want as well.
I suspect I will write to my MP/MEP about the same time as you write to yours! ;)
i agree in some aspects BB, but to discourage people from riding is, i think, i bit extreme (maybe a poor choice of word there btw)
all i see this reform as formulated stepping stones into the big bad world of biking.
personally speaking, bhp on a bike isn't everything. too many newbie bikers think that the only way to go is to go big on bhp. any muppet can go fast in a straight line, there is hardly any skill involved in that. the best fun (and i say fun as that what biking should be about) i've had on a bike is on a vfr400 which kicks out a massive 56 bhp!! and thats simply by cornering ability.
it just makes me laugh when people pass their direct access, and crack straight onto to a gixxer thou, for instance, and then wonder why they get passed by people on small capacity engined bikes.
its all down to know where and when you can utilise the power, and with the reform, i think many bikers will begin to appreciate what bikes can or can't do due to the restriction on how fast they can upgrade. which in time, will make them better, faster bikers which deep down, every biker wants.
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