Lower petrol & diesel prices e-petition

[470four]

http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/347

Please sign the e-petition and pass it on to your mates to join in. Once one hundred thousand signatures are reached, the government have to take it seriously. The required amount of signatures have almost been reached. Please do not leave this to others, it'll only take you a few minutes.

[Dabz]

They have to raise it in parliament, they don't have to take it seriously...

[Snowy]

I would sign it if there was a parallel petition requesting the doubling of tax on fags and booze to make up the difference for the lost revenue...

Someone's got to pay for what we spend. Bet that makes me Mr Popular...... ;D ;D

[Squashed_Fly]

This has already been done soooo many times. Lost count of how many'e-petitions' I've seen.

Anything where you can go on from 10 different computers and have 10 different 'signatures' is never to going to be taken seriously. If you want change, block the fuel trucks again. Positive, peaceful action is the way to do it, not a meaningless e-form....!

[Ducatista]

I think this is a total waste of time.
In these economic times, leisure is not a high priority when issues like defending the country are at stake.
If you can't afford your fuel bills then get a vehicle that's cheaper to run (bicycle?), ride more economically or don't travel as much i.e. cut your cloth to suit or get a 2nd job at Argos in the run up to Xmas.

If a fat middle-aged bird like me can cycle from Chippenham to Bath then most of you can get on yer bike (and yes I have been told that I have all the charm of Norman Tebbitt before).

[470four]

Im not asking for any moral high-ground here, just asking for 2 minutes of your time?

Hey, it may not get anything done at all but if no-one officailly complains then nothing will get done? Im not expecting the MP's to complain personally on their wage?

I do have a bicycle, its in my shed and staying there. I raced/rode Downhill mountainbikes for over 12 years with many a crash & graze, many big tracks in Switzerland, France, Wales etc... the last time I rode on public roads it scared the cr*p out of me. :o :o

Having bought said motorcycle it will need fuel in it to be used, I feel the price of said fuel is an issue close to our hearts - if you are happy with paying over seven pounds a gallon then fair doo's - Im NOT. ;)

[Snowy]

Of course the price is close to our hearts as it directly affects us as motorcyclists and most of us have to live within a budget. But so does the British economy so if the tax is reduced from fuel, where exactly is the shortfall to be made up from? Increase the tax on something else, continue to cull our emergency services, stop funding the NHS, shoot the bankers?

[Crosbie]

In these economic times, leisure is not a high priority when issues like defending the country are at stake.

Ok a large portion will be signing the petition on the deciding factor it will reduced their running costs for their two 4X4's and sports car but what about those who operate haulage businesses, personal services ie taxis, buses, trains etc. If they are struggling to continue to operate due to rising fuel costs that cost is passed on to the tax payer in cost rises of final produce/service. So signing the petition will be of benefit to you whether you use a taxi, bus, train or buy food drink from supermarkets (one or which will apply to you) ;).

Tho as Snowy rightly says the bill will be footed elsewhere. Or prehaps it could be saved from elsewhere ie benefits/compensation/getting rid or jobs worths in government/local governemnt

Who knows :D

[Squashed_Fly]

To be honest, I think we get a good deal on fuel considering what it has to go through to get to us. It should be taxed highly and Ducatista is right. If you can't afford it, switch to a cheaper to run vehicle.

The kick in the balls is how cheap the rest of the world seems to get it, but until they get the fact that emissions contribute to climate change, and tax their fuel accordingly, then we just have to set the moral example and stop complaining about it!

[470four]

Squashed Fly - once again you have astounded us with your outright capacity to talk supreme b0llocks.

In the time it has taken you to write the above dirge you could have been filling out the petition?

Cheaper fuel - double the price of tobacco & cigarettes. Done.

I dont deny anybody the right to have a drink, but cigarettes etc are not good for you in anyway, shape or form & as such are not necessary, if people still feel they have to smoke then they can pay the price. I have to drive to get to work, THATS a necessity. ;)

[470four]

In these economic times, leisure is not a high priority when issues like defending the country are at stake.

Ok a large portion will be signing the petition on the deciding factor it will reduced their running costs for their two 4X4's and sports car but what about those who operate haulage businesses, personal services ie taxis, buses, trains etc. If they are struggling to continue to operate due to rising fuel costs that cost is passed on to the tax payer in cost rises of final produce/service. So signing the petition will be of benefit to you whether you use a taxi, bus, train or buy food drink from supermarkets (one or which will apply to you) ;).

Tho as Snowy rightly says the bill will be footed elsewhere. Or prehaps it could be saved from elsewhere ie benefits/compensation/getting rid or jobs worths in government/local governemnt

Who knows :D

+1

Cheaper fuel = cheaper transport = cheaper food and drink - winwin situation. :)

[Snowy]

In these economic times, leisure is not a high priority when issues like defending the country are at stake.

Ok a large portion will be signing the petition on the deciding factor it will reduced their running costs for their two 4X4's and sports car but what about those who operate haulage businesses, personal services ie taxis, buses, trains etc. If they are struggling to continue to operate due to rising fuel costs that cost is passed on to the tax payer in cost rises of final produce/service. So signing the petition will be of benefit to you whether you use a taxi, bus, train or buy food drink from supermarkets (one or which will apply to you) ;).

Tho as Snowy rightly says the bill will be footed elsewhere. Or prehaps it could be saved from elsewhere ie benefits/compensation/getting rid or jobs worths in government/local governemnt

Who knows :D

+1

Cheaper fuel = cheaper transport = cheaper food and drink - winwin situation. :)


Or another possible scenario:

Cheaper fuel = cheaper transport = increased profits for haulage firms and Tesco = 30% basic rate tax, 40% VAT and a private NHS not available to you if you're over 50, smoke or don't take out an Insurance Policy for £200 per month.

[Ducatista]

Im not asking for any moral high-ground here, just asking for 2 minutes of your time?

Sorry, but some of us won't do it if we don't believe it's morally justified.

I think there are far greater priorities right now, like the deficit, national defence, NHS, cuts to services for the vulnerable/elderly to name just a few.
If you can't afford it then don't have it.
If you can't afford to get to work then you have to rethink your options.

[470four]

Im not asking for any moral high-ground here, just asking for 2 minutes of your time?

Sorry, but some of us won't do it if we don't believe it's morally justified.

I think there are far greater priorities right now, like the deficit, national defence, NHS, cuts to services for the vulnerable/elderly to name just a few.
If you can't afford it then don't have it.
If you can't afford to get to work then you have to rethink your options.

Dont do it then, nobody is forcing you to.

I can afford it, wont be selling it any time this century & apparently now I have to get pregnant, have four kids & live off of benefits as comutting is beyond me. :D

I can recall not so long ago filling up a bike tank for £5. I filled the Ducati tank this morning and I still had room with £20 in there?? Not good. We as a country are getting screwed for fuel prices & all Im doing is asking people to put there names on an online petition?? Simples!

[Snowy]

Dont do it then, nobody is forcing you to.


That's true, however, your post No.9 to SF seems to suggest something different?

[Squashed_Fly]

470four - I didn't mention anything about smoking - not really sure what you're on about.

Just because you put up a petition, it's a bit childish throwing your toys out the pram because not everyone agrees with you.

We are alll entitled to opinions. you seem to think everybody who disagrees with you is stupid or ignorant. There's a word for that - it's called arrogance!

[470four]

Dont do it then, nobody is forcing you to.


That's true, however, your post No.9 to SF seems to suggest something different?


I said "could have", not "should have" or "why didnt you?" :P ;)

[470four]

470four - I didn't mention anything about smoking - not really sure what you're on about.

Just because you put up a petition, it's a bit childish throwing your toys out the pram because not everyone agrees with you.

We are alll entitled to opinions. you seem to think everybody who disagrees with you is stupid or ignorant. There's a word for that - it's called arrogance!

I never said you said anything about smoking??! My post pointed out that the lost tax could be made up from increased tax on cigarettes, I did not expect you to understand that. :P

I do not think everybody that disagrees with me is stupid at all? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

However - your prevoius posts on here have proved that yes - you-Squashed Fly - are indeed stupid/ignorant/all of the above, your little "lets nuke Afganistan!" thread proved all of that and many more. ;)

[wiltsdan]

[smiley=bath.gif]
Bath time?

[470four]

[smiley=bath.gif]
Bath time?

;D ;D

[redken1]

Get a 2nd job (I reckon most of the 3 million unemployed would like one)
Put Tobacco tax up (£11.1 billion already)
Cycle to work, etc.


If this thread is anything to go by, the ruling classes who got us in to this economic mess are succeeding in their “Divide and conquer” the masses strategy.

Just a few alternatives to make savings: Scrap trident (£15 billion).
Bankers pay back our £30 billion and stop receiving huge bonuses for failing.
One school costing £2.5 million to build by conventional funding costs the taxpayer Approx £26 million when the profiteers on the Public Private Partnerships (hardly a partnership) schemes get their cut.
Tax relief on pensions - Treasury figures reveal that 60 per cent of tax relief, close to £22 billion, goes to higher rate taxpayers, including 25 per cent – nearly £10 billion a year – to the top one per cent of earners, on more than £150,000 a year. >:(And so on and so on……

As I’m not a member of the “We are all in this together" club I will be joining the millions who take to the streets in protest against the cuts.
[smiley=thumbsup.gif]

[Ducatista]

& apparently now I have to get pregnant, have four kids & live off of benefits as comutting is beyond me.

Not quite what I meant by "rethinking your options" but of course I was speaking generally and not about you personally. There are plenty of options beyond private transport like walking/bus/lift share/train/bicycle.
If you have put yourself in a position where you HAVE to use private transpot then that is your responsibility and a consequence of choices you have made.
You need to take responsibility for your actions.
It's now essential that we all live within our means both personally and nationally.


& all Im doing is asking people to put there names on an online petition??

Which is completely pointless, because there is no way in this severe economic crisis that economic policy is going to be changed simply because you (and others) want your petrol to be cheaper.

I don't agree with your point about cigarettes and booze. Other people are entitled to their hobbies. If you have put yourself in a position (by choice of home and job) where the only way to get to work is by private transport then that's your choice. You do not have the right to restrict the choices of others to smoke/drink.

I do not like the way you are trying to coerce people into doing something they don't want by minimising their views (which isn't working BTW).
I have to say that I also did not like the way you volunteered me to post my sidi boots (when there was no way I could get them to the post office on my bike) and I didn't like the way you tried to hijack the girls rideout for your own political agenda as well.

Ask whatever you want, but please stick to asking and not coercion.
Not everyone agrees with your agenda and you have to accept that.

If you don't want to agree with me that's fine, but I planned my life so that I have 7 options for transport to work. I don't expect the worlds oil reserves, UK economic policy or currency exchange rates to fit around my choices and I think that's extremely self-centered.

[470four]

& apparently now I have to get pregnant, have four kids & live off of benefits as comutting is beyond me.

Not quite what I meant by "rethinking your options" but of course I was speaking generally and not about you personally. There are plenty of options beyond private transport like walking/bus/lift share/train/bicycle.
If you have put yourself in a position where you HAVE to use private transpot then that is your responsibility and a consequence of choices you have made.
You need to take responsibility for your actions.
It's now essential that we all live within our means both personally and nationally.


& all Im doing is asking people to put there names on an online petition??

Which is completely pointless, because there is no way in this severe economic crisis that economic policy is going to be changed simply because you (and others) want your petrol to be cheaper.

I don't agree with your point about cigarettes and booze. Other people are entitled to their hobbies. If you have put yourself in a position (by choice of home and job) where the only way to get to work is by private transport then that's your choice. You do not have the right to restrict the choices of others to smoke/drink.

I do not like the way you are trying to coerce people into doing something they don't want by minimising their views (which isn't working BTW).
I have to say that I also did not like the way you volunteered me to post my sidi boots (when there was no way I could get them to the post office on my bike) and I didn't like the way you tried to hijack the girls rideout for your own political agenda as well.

Ask whatever you want, but please stick to asking and not coercion.
Not everyone agrees with your agenda and you have to accept that.

If you don't want to agree with me that's fine, but I planned my life so that I have 7 options for transport to work. I don't expect the worlds oil reserves, UK economic policy or currency exchange rates to fit around my choices and I think that's extremely self-centered.

At the minute we are in the middle of a recession, I would LOVE to be able to walk to work, to have it a mile down the road and save my petrol for the weekends? Sadly jobs today are few and far between & I cannot afford to move house to have yet another employer go under?

Public transport is both expensive and unreliable, I enjoy the freedom that I have having my own transport? I go where I want when I like & dont have to fight for a tiny seat on a bus/train. I would rather walk somewhere than take a train/bus, riding a bicycle with todays traffic is suicidal - & I salute anybody that does do it. :)

The ladies rideout? (This thread is getting more diverse by the second...) I asked very civilly & politely if they would join us, being that they were meeting at the same place we were an hour or so before? They declined, I wished them a happy ride.

No dramas.

Your boots? I suggested they could be posted to you? Im sorry this offended you and got involved? :-/ Its a public forum & I was just trying to help?

Im not suggesting this petition will save the world. If it does something, good! If it doesnt, we tried. :)

"Dont wait for your ship to come in, swim out and meet the bl**dy thing!" Barry Sheene

[Jon_W]

They have to raise it in parliament, they don't have to take it seriously...

True!

I think this is the most sensible comment so far... :P

[bobf279]

I am struggling to see how this thread fits in "General Bike Chat"

[Rabb]

Squashed Fly - once again you have astounded us with your outright capacity to talk supreme b0llocks.

In the time it has taken you to write the above dirge you could have been filling out the petition?

Cheaper fuel - double the price of tobacco & cigarettes. Done.

I dont deny anybody the right to have a drink, but cigarettes etc are not good for you in anyway, shape or form & as such are not necessary, if people still feel they have to smoke then they can pay the price. I have to drive to get to work, THATS a necessity. ;)

470 four - obesity and lack of exercise are massive burdens on the NHS.
Would you propose that fatty foods have an 'unhealthy foods' tax put on them?
The revenue raised from taxes on smoking and alcohol at least in part go to fund the NHS however if you gorge yourself on an unhealthy diet is it right that other peoples taxes fund your glutony?
I'm just playing devils advocate.....

[Rabb]

I am struggling to see how this thread fits in "General Bike Chat"

Agreed

[redken1]

Not wishing to be disrespectful- may I suggest that it might be the case that bikes run on fuel.

[Rabb]

Not wishing to be disrespectful- may I suggest that it might be the case that bikes run on fuel.

Agreed - I'm just playing.

Fuel prices are ridiculous in this country
Highest prices in Europe (and most of the rest of the world)
Rip off Britain culture again comes into play........

[470four]

They have to raise it in parliament, they don't have to take it seriously...

True!

I think this is the most sensible comment so far... :P

It being raised in parliament will highlight the fact that so many people arnt happy with fuel prices? If no one complains they will assume everybody is happy & keep on jacking the price up?

No complaints = no action, we can put up with it and sit on our hands or we, the masses can take action? :)

[Snowy]

Nobody is happy paying the prices we do. I put £80 in one of the cars yesterday and it's costing £50 to fill the GS up. Of course I'm not happy. But, before I sign any petition or protest about fuel prices, I want to know where the balance is going to be made up. There will be no drop in tax on fuel without another tax going up or a cutback somewhere else in the budget.

I would prefer keeping fuel prices where they are, where I have some means of control over what I pay because I have some choice over my mileage (as most do) rather than closure of NHS services, increases to basic rate tax, VAT or some other scheme that will hit the less well off than the majority of us on this forum who ride bikes with a degree of choice.

I have to use my car for work as well. But I can do one less rideout a year, or miss a couple of trips to the H&C a year, or ride at 70mph instead of 80 mph on the motorway, or combine two trips into one in the car etc etc. Its so easy to complain without having an alternative which is'nt based on personal politics, biased attitudes or general apathy to actually having a complete plan of action as part of a bigger picture.

[redken1]

Unfortunately, it is all about making political choices. I offered up for consideration some suggested alternative measures for huge savings in post 20. It’s not rocket science – any tax which is not income based will always hit the poorest the hardest disproportionately because they have less disposable income. High tax on fuel is only one example.
I think we live in exiting times in the sense that millions of ordinary people have finally wised up to the inequality that exists. According to recent data from the British Social Attitudes survey, three-quarters of people in the UK believe that the gap between rich and poor in the UK is too high. Like it or not, call me a moaner if you wish, but many are not going to take it lying down. It's too late for me perhaps, but I want my children and granchildren to live in a fairer Britian.

[Snowy]

We want the same things Ken and I did note your suggestions, I just don't think they are realistic or achievable one way or another. I also don't see it being a choice when it comes to politics: Labour, Tory or Liberal they are all no different than each other. We need a sound economic base and stability before we can move forward and our taxation system is part of a core budget. It can be changed over time but not by changing ad hoc individual elements - it has to take the whole system into account.

And I don't think you are a moaner at all - I think your arguments are well thought out and presented. They're just not the same as mine.

[redken1]

Sorry Graeme, I didn’t explain my thoughts clearly- I agree all the parties are the same give or take a few minor differences in policies. I was referring to the political choices with regard to taxation etc. We can obviously differ on what measures need to be introduced to bring about change for the better, but the ever widening gap between the rich and poor is a matter of fact. I have genuine concerns that if the politicians continue to ignore the inequality that exists in our society, large numbers of those affected will not be turning to the ballot box to redress the balance. Apologies again, my comments with reference to moaning were not aimed at you. [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

[Squashed_Fly]

People have lost sight of the difference between what we want, and what we need. We need to have basic facilities - roofs over heads, running water, basic food etc. However people seem to think that they 'need' all the other luxuries in life.

I'm guilty, as much as others, of living outside my means at times, justifying my spend habits with all sorts of reasons, but when you compare how easy we have it as a society to other countries that are genuinly struggling, I think we have more important things to worry about than fuel prices.

Since I'm clearly uneducated, stupid and ignorant, then feel free to ignore my ideas, but I would have a duel tariff for petrol/diesel. One for business use, and one for personal. Tax should be reduced on business tarriff fuel (you could have specific pumps set up like the debit/credit card pumps, but for fuel cards) to make things easier for struggling industries who already have to pay high business tax rates, and then we can justify the higher tax rates on our personal fuel for our bikes, sports cars etc that are 'toys'. Even family cars should pay the higher rates - perhaps then joe bloggs will think twice before giving his overweight kids a lift to school in the chelsea tractor, rather than making them walk and get fitter/healthier etc. Yes, this is a generalisation, but if the latest stats about overweight & underfit kids are to be believed, one that's not far from the truth.

The sad fact is, when it comes to backbone, none of our political parties have any really. It's always the 'poll winner' policies that get advertised, with no-one willing to deal with many of the true issues making the economy colapse such as benefit fraud, immigration, the fact that it's better for many people to be on the dole than have jobs to name & discipline in our schools and young people but a few.

If we could get those things sorted out, get out of the EU, and stop interfering in other countries business & politics, then we could comfortably lower the tax on fuel as it wouldn't need to be so high to support the stupid decisions of our so called leaders.

[redken1]

SF, Businesses already enjoy a tax concession on fuel.

[Squashed_Fly]

Perhaps that needs to be a better concession then, supported by the increased duty on on personal fuel. The one caveat being that you can can claim commuter miles as work mileage. That way no-one can say they can't afford the fuel to get to work if they are claiming back 45p a mile, and the increases only hit us for our personal mileage?

If I was asked to go back to working in the office now that I live in Swindon, I couldn't afford to work in Cheltenham really. But as I work from home, when I do go in I can claim back those miles as it's technically not commuting

[redken1]

Royal Bank of Scotland, last year awarded its highest-paid executive a base salary of £1.8m, 12.5 times more than the UK's Prime Minister and six times more than the country's highest-paid civil servant.

Forcing a part time cleaner on the minimum wage to pay more for fuel to commute to her/his place of work in order to subsidise business travel for executives (like above) would be a real disincentive for many to take up low paid employment.

[Squashed_Fly]

Forcing a part time cleaner on the minimum wage to pay more for fuel to commute to her/his place of work in order to subsidise business travel for executives (like above) would be a real disincentive for many to take up low paid employment.


Agreed. That's why we should be allowed to claim back the cost of commuter mileage

[Harry87]

It's luck of the draw. We are all born into different social structures and classes. There will always be rich, always be poor. Life's a bitch. Get on with it.

Be happy and content with what you have. No one cares about you. No one will give you a happier life. So enjoy your short time on Earth.

As, for the petition, has it got to 100,000 yet?

Edit: Ah, I see it has 101,000 'signatures'.

[redken1]

It's luck of the draw. We are all born into different social structures and classes. There will always be rich, always be poor. Life's a bitch. Get on with it.

Be happy and content with what you have. No one cares about you. No one will give you a happier life. So enjoy your short time on Earth.

As, for the petition, has it got to 100,000 yet?

Edit: Ah, I see it has 101,000 'signatures'.

If getting on with it is your chosen path in life that’s your prerogative but it’s not mine. I always find it amusing when people assume that an individual, who challenges something they don’t believe in, is unhappy.

Women were not given the right to vote – they had to fight for it. Ordinary people led a struggle against the slave trade for decades before the government of the day abolished it. With respect, all the major milestones for the better throughout our history would never have come to fruition if our forefathers adopted a “Get on with it” attitude to life.

I am very happy and content in my personal life. What I am not happy about however, is the ever widening gap between the haves and the have-nots. For example: A young girl that I know recently attended her local dental practice for treatment, which consisted of two appointments of 45 minutes duration each. One hour and thirty minutes in the dentist’s chair cost her two weeks wages.
>:( >:( >:(

[Harry87]

Glad I amused you. Do not get me wrong, I agree with what you say. I was merely stating the facts of this world, and that they must be accepted/'got on with'. Of course we need to stand up for what we believe in, and challenge when it is required.

[470four]

I've never understood why you have to pay so much for dentists? They should pay you! Such torture... :(

You cut yourself - it heals

You break a bone - it heals BETTER than new!

Why for the love of God dont TEETH heal themselves?? Why are you condemned to them eventually rotting in your mouth?

(Tsh.)

Agreed Ken, nothing will probably happen anytime soon in my lifetime but I can only hope for a better life for our children. :)