View Full Version : Post-Crash Legal Advice
RachaelEllen
16-04-12, 04:58 PM
Hi all,
As I am sure many of you are aware via either Facebook or SBQE2's post (my dad) I ended up riding into the back of a van last wednesday and basically smashing up the front of my Kawasaki ER6f. The van was a work vehicle but the driver was very kind and basically said he aimed to not go through insurance and for us to settle it privately as his boss’ father in law carried out repairs to vehicles. This was good news for me as I only have third party fire and theft insurance so was therefore unable to claim for the damage to my bike (the accident was my fault). I rang the man on Friday and left a message on his voicemail thanking him for staying with me until the recovery van came and telling him to let me know when he had a quote for the van. Today (Monday) I received a text from the van driver saying “ ...I am sorry to tell you but for legal reasons I will have to go through your insurance...”. I have a £950 excess (£550 compulsory and £400 voluntary) on my insurance so I assume the damage to the van will not come to this much ( At the bottom of my essay is a link to an image of the damage to the van) so I’ll have to pay for the damage. I am a month away from my no claims bonus which would reduce my insurance from £700 to £400 approximately so obviously i would ideally not involve my insurers. If i inform my insurers but the value of the damage does not meet the excess does this still count as a claim? Do I have to go through my insurers if the other driver requests it?
I have never been in a collision before so any advice on this would be greatly appreciated :)
Link to image of the damage to the van : http://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af110/PillionRider/vandamage.jpg
mick_benson
16-04-12, 05:18 PM
appeal to his better nature, looking at that pic it should't cost much to fix,
RachaelEllen
16-04-12, 05:22 PM
I think the problem is that it was a work van, so I don't know whether it is a work policy. They aren't a big multi-national company or anything though :-/
mick_benson
16-04-12, 05:35 PM
i get that but that door shouldnt cost much more than a say £200
ask to see the quotes dont take there word for the cost
I'm sure one of the legal eagles on here will be able to advise you. Me? I aint got a clue TBH. Hope it can be sorted quickly for you though. :(
SupeRDel
16-04-12, 06:20 PM
Offer the driver/van owners 400 quid to call it quits!
If it is a small company then the van maybe a leased van which will cause a problem when returned to the lease company
SupeRDel
16-04-12, 06:26 PM
Third party insurance with a £950 excess.... :o :o :o
How much was the original premium?
I must be out of touch
pilninggas
16-04-12, 06:31 PM
If he does claim via your insurance it they will pay all of the costs. Your excess relates to you claiming on your insurance with TPFT this would be if it caught fire or if it was stolen.
My only advice is don't get stressed (not easy i know), and remember as much as not accruing no-claims is frustrating these sorts of accidents are exactly what insurance is intended for.
Senna(Dan)
16-04-12, 07:12 PM
Check the bay, you may find a door at a stupidly low price.
Movano doors can be picked up for about £100 and I'm sure it wouldn't cost £300 to get it fittted!
My advice for what its worth is to tell your insurer the full details of the accident and let them deal with it. Thats what you pay them for in the first instance. Remember its not in the other parties best interests to try and get it done on the cheap just to help with your future insurance premiums. I'm sure if the situation were reversed, we would all want our own pride and joys repaired to the highest spec with all new parts, not bought secondhand off Ebay. What about his time off work to get the van fixed, loss of income etc etc? Best thing in my view is hand it over to the insurers, forget about the other party and concentrate on getting yours fixed.
You must tell your insurer about the accident anyway irrespective of blame and whether there is a claim or not so your premium is going to get loaded either way.
I agree with Snowy, bite the bullet & do it! Tough but the best way.
BB
Third party insurance with a £950 excess.... :o :o :o
How much was the original premium?
I must be out of touch
Del, it's horrific what the kids have to pay for insurance, car or bike. Often much cheaper to buy the vehicle than insure it :o
BB
wiltshire builders
17-04-12, 04:06 PM
Check the bay, you may find a door at a stupidly low price.
Movano doors can be picked up for about £100 and I'm sure it wouldn't cost £300 to get it fittted!
I think you're missing the point here. This is someone elses vehicle and a sign written one at that. If the cost comes to less than £1000 if be bloody surprised.
The door would have to be repared, sprayed (also blended in to match existing paint) and the signage re-done and while this work is being carried out they would need a van so they could carry on working or claim for lost earnings.
I've been in this exact situation before and it's horrible but I'm affraid it's the 3rd party calling the shots.
Like Snowy said leave it in the hands of the insurers. At least there will be no comebacks for you. It wont take long to build up your NCB and try to keep looking at the bigger picture.
Demonbaker
17-04-12, 04:29 PM
I'm pretty sure you will have to inform your insurance company anyway, even if you were to pay cash. I agree with wiltshire builders the job will cost well over a grand. You pay insurance for a reason now is the time to use it.
Bonnielass
17-04-12, 04:38 PM
Can't help with the legal side but the advice given sounds good. Was there much damage to your bike? And glad you're ok, that's the main thing!!
Ducatista
17-04-12, 04:40 PM
You have no choice but to inform your insurers (current and new).
This is a material fact and you MUST tell them.
There is a double whammy here I'm afraid.
Both of losing NCD and being loaded in the future because of the accident.
You have no choice about the latter you MUST declare it (the consequences of not doing so are bad).
You could potentially pay for the claim and settle it with your insurer. This means it wouldn't be a claim and you would not lose your NCD, but you'd still have to declare an accident/incident.
The costs for these sort of things are often higher than you might expect so it may not be worth it.
I am sure you aren't attempting to do anything wrong, but just for information if you don't declare something and it later gets discovered, then your insurance could be cancelled for "deliberate non-disclosure". If that happens then you have to declare the cancellation forever. The question on quotes is have you EVER been refused or had insurance cancelled. This means you can't use the internet and quotes will be very expensive and you'll be refused so it's a black mark forever.
I'm not suggesting you are attempting to do anything like that, just putting it out there for info for everyone.
You cannot change the fact that there was an accident and you must declare that and you will almost certainly get loaded.
The only thing you can change is whether there is a claim and you can settle this with your insurer after the event if it's financially viable to do so but this almost certainly won't all get settled before your renewal unfortunately.
Mark_Able
17-04-12, 08:11 PM
I would suspect he wants to go through the insurance so he can claim whiplash... >:(
Bonnielass
17-04-12, 08:54 PM
You cynic Mark!! :D
Senna(Dan)
17-04-12, 09:15 PM
Unfortunately it doesn't matter how light the impact was, they will always claim whiplash. My mate got hit at a roundabout at about 5mph and the insurance company were asking if he had whiplash when the only damage was a little scratch on the bumper and a dink that pushed out by hand. They were saying he could claim as doctors can't prove it, he is too honest and told them where to shove it because it will only add to vicious cycle in the industry!
Ducatista
17-04-12, 10:17 PM
Unfortunately it doesn't matter how light the impact was, they will always claim whiplash.
My guess is that the company don't want to go outside insurance in case they get a personal injury claim against them.
I know it would seem unlikely in a rear shunt, but as already said, why would/should a third party expose themselves to any unnecessary risks?
It makes little difference to the situation anyway.
The accident has to be claimed either way and the claim can be paid off after the event if it's viable.
RachaelEllen
18-04-12, 09:13 AM
Hi Guys,
Thank you for all your advice, I really do appreciate it, like I say i'm very new to all this.
I contacted my insurers and they informed me that I wouldn't have to pay the excess on a third party claim (phew) so i've gone ahead with that. I knew I would have to inform future insurers of the accident but was just really trying to avoid the claim as it would reduce my insurance by at least a couple of hundred pounds (although I understand that having an accident on my record would alter this).
Bonnielass I was actually very fortunate with the bike, it appears to be mainly cosmetic damage. The headlamp bracket is a little skewed but the rest is just fairing work. Dad's on ebay as we speak ;D
Blackandchrome
18-04-12, 12:41 PM
Glad to know you walked away from this experience and that "Dad's" efforts are amusing!
Perhaps you should also take some time out and think why you ended up parking your motorcycle in the back of a works van?
Negligence springs to mind as well as inexperience.
I am not trying to take the moral highground here; but the bottom line is you screwed up. Yes you have walked away from the incident and can have a laugh about it now. But the reality is that you need to address the facts behind your riding into the back of somebody else's vehicle. ;)
Ducatista
18-04-12, 01:00 PM
The important thing is that you are ok.
It's annoying to pay more on insurance but it's minor in the scheme of things.
I'm sure you've already beaten yourself up about it.
We all make mistakes, but it's a good idea to reflect on what you could do differently.
Dad's on ebay as we speak ;D
Thats what good Dads are for ;D ;D
We've all done something daft (that's the Royal 'we' by the way) ;D ;D
I know I did a few daft things when I started and had a couple of incidents which taught me way more than someone could have lectured me about. Oh gawd...sounding very old now :-[ :)
Xenocide
18-04-12, 04:35 PM
I don't recall anyone asking for advice on their riding...
Ducatista
18-04-12, 04:51 PM
I don't recall anyone asking for advice on their riding...
.........and no riding advice has been offered
Glad to know you walked away from this experience and that "Dad's" efforts are amusing!
Perhaps you should also take some time out and think why you ended up parking your motorcycle in the back of a works van?
Negligence springs to mind as well as inexperience.
I am not trying to take the moral highground here; but the bottom line is you screwed up. Yes you have walked away from the incident and can have a laugh about it now. But the reality is that you need to address the facts behind your riding into the back of somebody else's vehicle. ;)
Diplomacy not exactly your strong point is it?
If you read the initial post, she admitted it was her fault and this thread is about dealing with the aftermath of the insurance side of things. Blame has already been proportioned so why beat her up about it? I'm sure lessons have been learnt and filed away for future reference which is how it is for all of us. No one has exclusion rights from making errors, its the learning from them that's important.
wiltshire builders
18-04-12, 04:55 PM
I don't recall anyone asking for advice on their riding...
.........and no riding advice has been offered
Touche ;)
Glad to know you walked away from this experience and that "Dad's" efforts are amusing!
Perhaps you should also take some time out and think why you ended up parking your motorcycle in the back of a works van?
Negligence springs to mind as well as inexperience.
I am not trying to take the moral highground here; but the bottom line is you screwed up. Yes you have walked away from the incident and can have a laugh about it now. But the reality is that you need to address the facts behind your riding into the back of somebody else's vehicle. ;)
I think laughing about it is the last thing on Rachael's mind right now - and it's a bit insulting to her to suggest she finds it the least bit funny....
Ducatista
18-04-12, 05:10 PM
Shall we stop now? - pretty please
I think all comments were intended in good faith because we care about about a fellow biker even if some came across a little undiplomatic.
I'm sure this isn't what she'd want.
Shall we stop now? - pretty please
I think all comments were intended in good faith because we care about about a fellow biker even if some came across a little undiplomatic.
I'm sure this isn't what she'd want.
Totally agree
Oh to be a perfect rider !!
But sadly nobody is ever perfect in anything and for anyone to say they are is just plain big headed and asking for a massive fall......we all learn from the experiences we go through in life and thats what life is all about
Glad you are physically ok Rachael and a bike is just a piece of machinery at the end of the day.
:) :) :) :) :)
Blackandchrome
19-04-12, 12:47 PM
No offence intended.
I have had my share of tumbles too. ;)
Wish my dad was as helpful :(
supermancss
20-04-12, 10:37 AM
If he does claim via your insurance it they will pay all of the costs. Your excess relates to you claiming on your insurance with TPFT this would be if it caught fire or if it was stolen.
My only advice is don't get stressed (not easy i know), and remember as much as not accruing no-claims is frustrating these sorts of accidents are exactly what insurance is intended for.
From what you have written I have interpreted it to mean that he wotn have to pay as his bike wasn't on fire or stolen? There is still the third party element.
You would be paying the first £950 of the claim, unless it was less than £950 you wont be paying the full excess amount.
You will however be charged more for insurance in the future as your classed as more likely to make a claim again as youve now had 1 claim.
Ducatista
20-04-12, 11:30 AM
From what you have written I have interpreted it to mean that he wotn have to pay as his bike wasn't on fire or stolen?
No, I think you've interpreted it wrongly.
There is no excess when a third party claims against your insurance.
The excess applies if you claim off your own insurance (which isn't happening in this case).
wiltshire builders
20-04-12, 06:21 PM
From what you have written I have interpreted it to mean that he wotn have to pay as his bike wasn't on fire or stolen?
No, I think you've interpreted it wrongly.
There is no excess when a third party claims against your insurance.
The excess applies if you claim off your own insurance (which isn't happening in this case).
I never knew that. It makes it a little easier to swallow I suppose.
Hope the restoration is going well.
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