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Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
My CBR400 (NC23) is giving me a bit of grief.... again!
The problem goes like this:
that on starting it with choke (he's an old boy!), letting him run for a bit to get warm, I then climb aboard, switch the lights on, adjust choke - if necessary, put him into gear and then...... he cuts out! Now, anyone who doesn't know the foibles of "Ollie" thinks, oh stupid woman rider she's stalled the bike! Well, no actually, I haven't even had chance to let the clutch out yet! It's most annoying as I then have to go through a number of procedures in order to get him started again, switching the lights off and putting him back into neutral, all time consuming and annoying to any traffic if it happens at the traffic lights.... :-[
He's been on a treatment, since last winter, of Silkolene FST every third or fourth tank and especially when the temps started dropping as we had a major problem last October of carb icing. I replaced the battery about 2 months ago (so that's not the problem). The headlight bulbs have been replaced for genuine Honda ones as the previous owner had non standard ones in that were drawing too much power from the battery - let alone the fact that they were too big for the holder and he'd cut the lugs!
The only other thing that someone has suggested to me that might be upsetting him is the restrictor kit (washers in the carbs) which has to be in until next August. As I can't/won't risk having the kit taken out to ride around to test for a bit, can anyone else make any suggestions what the problem could be?
Any help would be appreciated as I love my little Ollie very much but this bad behaviour needs to be sorted out or else I may need to take drastic action >:(
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Faulty sidestand cut out switch?
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Hey R1chie, if only. Don't think Mr Honda had thought about those back in 1989. Thanks for your suggestion though.
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Not sure then, have you checked the air filter and fuel pump recently?
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Side stand switch. ( yeah, I know you might not have one)
Clutch switch.
Kill switch.
Battery leads loose.
Loose fuse perhaps.
Clutch drag. ( wrong grade oil/bike not been used for a while/needs adjusting at the pushrod, or whatever type of clutch it is)
Wearing new gloves ;)
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Hi Biker mouse,
If you can't get it sorted I am more than happy to help you out. But I do have to charge for my time(£15 per/hr! :-[
I have been able to help Julia and R2D2 out and am happy to come to your place and see if we can sort your bike.
Pm me if I can help! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
Finbar
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Sounds electrical. I assume when it runs it runs fine.
Does it turn over ok?? Do the lights dim at lower revs??
All that being good it sounds exactly like a sidestand switch. Some CBR400's do have them. Check the clutch and sidestand switch.
If you are still stuck I will take a look if you like.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bikermouse
My CBR400 (NC23) is giving me a bit of grief.... again!
The problem goes like this:
that on starting it with choke (he's an old boy!), letting him run for a bit to get warm, I then climb aboard, switch the lights on, adjust choke - if necessary, put him into gear and then...... he cuts out! Now, anyone who doesn't know the foibles of "Ollie" thinks, oh stupid woman rider she's stalled the bike! Well, no actually, I haven't even had chance to let the clutch out yet! It's most annoying as I then have to go through a number of procedures in order to get him started again, switching the lights off and putting him back into neutral, all time consuming and annoying to any traffic if it happens at the traffic lights.... :-[
He's been on a treatment, since last winter, of Silkolene FST every third or fourth tank and especially when the temps started dropping as we had a major problem last October of carb icing. I replaced the battery about 2 months ago (so that's not the problem). The headlight bulbs have been replaced for genuine Honda ones as the previous owner had non standard ones in that were drawing too much power from the battery - let alone the fact that they were too big for the holder and he'd cut the lugs!
The only other thing that someone has suggested to me that might be upsetting him is the restrictor kit (washers in the carbs) which has to be in until next August. As I can't/won't risk having the kit taken out to ride around to test for a bit, can anyone else make any suggestions what the problem could be?
Any help would be appreciated as I love my little Ollie very much but this bad behaviour needs to be sorted out or else I may need to take drastic action >:(
kj
As you've got a restrictor kit fitted, has this started happening since, by any chance? It sounds to me like you've got an air leak between the carbs and barrels. The carbs mount on a rubber inlet, which could well be perished. Either that, or the restrictors in the carbs are not fitted correctly and causing an air leak somehow. The rubber inlets are well known to perish and let air in, especially on an older engine. Worth a look at methinks... :-?
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Carb icing is an indication of it drawing too much cold air. Again, it could be a perished inlet.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
I agree with the suggestion of some kind of interuption from the kill switch, lean angle cut out switch or clutch sensor etc as it stops when you pick first gear. Does it have a fuel pump or is it just gravity fed. Im not familiar with the model of bike and what saftey switches it has. It doesnt sound terminal though.
If it can select first and it cuts out when you ride it along then its too much air getting in as also suggested, perished rubbers certainly sound like the most likely cause. I removed the air box from a 1200 bandit and stuck on the K&N cones on the back of the carbs and it got way too much air and cut out at 5mph hehe
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Thanks guys for your suggestions.
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
you might need this Repair Manual CBR400 http://www.carlsalter.com/motorcycle-manuals.asp
Scroll down till you see it models not in cc size on the Honda files
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Good set of manuals there Alan
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanTDM
Useful site!
BB
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
KJ, any better since turning up the tickover?
the carbs sounded out of balance, and need a set of gauges put on and adjusting....
you supply the keeeeebab, and il bring the gauges... :-)
jaydee. ;)
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Agree with everything suggested above...
If it's doing it the moment you’re dropping it into gear then its electrical problems with the safety kill circuit that bikes including yours has.
If the problem occurs with just the bike sat there in neutral then you gotta start looking at problems with either the air/fuel or ignition...including faulty rec/reg leaking AC into the DC circuit of the bike.
Good way to check for intake seal leaks is spray WD40 round them, if it gets sucked in when the engines running you got a leak :)
When I had a 400 it was one of the most reliable bikes I ever owned (and used daily everywhere), so don't give in once you got it sorted it will be solid for years.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Well it cut out PERMANENTLY this morning which pleased me, NOT! It didn't even get to the starting stalls (so to speak) - so now Ollie is in the naughty corner and will remain there for some time to come ;)
I'm on a mission now to find something more reliable for these little legs - and that doesn't include cruisers - they simply don't blow my hair back ;)
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Does the neutral light come on when you turn the ignition.Have you tried starting it with the sidestand up with the bike in gear and holding the clutch in.Normally it should start!
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
As above... is there any life??? Do the lights or park lights work??
Does it turn over??? If not have a fiddle with the side stand and the kill switch.
If it does turn over, check the HT cables and the connections.
Will take a look if you want.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Thanks all for your suggestions and offers of help. It's nothing to do with the side stand as it does not possess a side stand cut out switchy thingamy. It won't fire up (although I'll gladly set fire to it at present) - will bump start and the battery is relatively new (approx 2 months at most). It's going on a holi holiday to a friends where it will receive some tender loving care and where it won't notice if I arrive home with a younger model to replace it with ;)!
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
As the battery is new is your battery still charged do you have a trickle charger to check it? I'm thinking it could be a faulty alternator or regulator/rectifier so it only charges when the engine is spinning fast and creating a bigger current.
I reckon you could get any of the modern sportsbikes if your short they are so tiny..... i look rediculous on the fireblade at 6' 7"!
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Sounds like the charging circuit could be naff.
Have had similar on my Honda.
1. Have you uprated the headlight bulbs??
2. Check the ground connection (black one from the battery) at both the battery end and the frame end.
3. When you do start it, ride around with the lights either off or on sidelight. (This will charge the battery)
If that dosen't work...
With the bike running...
Turn the headlights on and watch to see if the lights get brighter when you rev the bike.
If they change, it indicates a fault with the rectifier / regulator. This will need changing. This is a known fault on Honda's and have had it myself.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
I recently replaced the light bulbs as a previous owner had put the incorrect ones in which were drawing too much power (and touching the glass cover!). That seemed to have sorted out the cutting out problem, for a while.
Turning on the headlights with the bike running tends to dim the lights!
I can't complain too much, the bike is, after all, 20 years old. It's done me well and other than really really wanting to ride the bleedin thing on Saturday I suppose I can't fault it.
oh well maybe it's a sign....
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
It has to be a charging problem, have you checked all the earth on the wiring system, you could possibly have a break in a wire or a bad fuse connection so when you go to put it in gear as it vibrates it makes the connection break thus causing the bike to cut out
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Old bikes never die... they just need more loving!!!!
Sounds like it could be a regulator/rectifier problem. Most likely rectifier.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Its a pretty easy fix by the sounds of it, id come and have a look for the price of a cuppa tea but your a little far away from me at the moment (until I move). If you cant be bothered im sure a garage wouldn't charge you too much just to do a circuit check on the electrics (some do it free) and then fix whats wrong. You can a clever gizmo that clips onto the battery terminals and tells you what is going on in the charging circuit.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Yes, I'm sure it is an easy fix for those that have a clue ;) So he's going on his winter break soon to a friend's where he can stay for as long as it takes to get to the bottom of the problem, and of course fitting in with the friend's rather heavy schedule. Not that I planned on too many rides between now and spring anyway (unless I bag that newer bike that I've got my little eye on.....)
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
What bike do you have your eye on? or is it a suprise [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
A Suzuki GS500F (the faired one) - going to look at one at the weekend to see if it's "the one". ;)
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Happy hunting, sounds like a good weekend! 8-)
If its a private sale touch the engine cases to see if they are warm when you get there tends to suggest it sounds a bit noisey when cold and might mean spending money on it. [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bikermouse
A Suzuki GS500F (the faired one) - going to look at one at the weekend to see if it's "the one". ;)
kj
Sorry to say you might be disappointed! Your 400 is way quicker (when it's running). Maybe try an SV650 if you can fit on it? [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Mark I get what you are saying..... however I don't hoon around on the 400 in any event and the riding position is killing my back and neck(which I have major problems with and require constant Chiro treatment for). We looked at one GS in Southampton and to be perfectly honest I wouldn't have given them £2.50 for it, it had been dropped and was in the tattiest condition I've ever seen, looked like someone had been on an off road adventure just prior to it being parked up. We then went over to Poole and saw another and took it out for a test ride. Verdict - not too bad - although it certainly needs a lowering kit for me to be perfectly comfortable with it. Certainly doesn't have the gruntish sound of my little Ollie but one can always change the can to get that effect. So I'm certainly not discounting it yet.....
The SV650 is way too high and even with a lowering kit and a modified seat I don't think I'll manage to get these little legs firmly on the floor.
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Hmm.....
May I suggest these?..............
http://i33.tinypic.com/vzbihv.jpg
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bikermouse
Verdict - not too bad - although it certainly needs a lowering kit for me to be perfectly comfortable with it.
Honda Star's just sold her F650CS, but we do still have the suspension dog-bones to reduce the rear height, they should fit any of the F650s and are a real doddle to fit - let either of us know if they'd interest you :)
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
I might know someone interested in those.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
What are you going to do with the CBR??? Keep it for a bit of fun??
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon_W
What are you going to do with the CBR??? Keep it for a bit of fun??
Probably sell it on. Still umming and aahing though as I do love my little CBR just not when he's being a miserable git!
kj
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bikermouse
Mark I get what you are saying..... however I don't hoon around on the 400 in any event and the riding position is killing my back and neck(which I have major problems with and require constant Chiro treatment for). We looked at one GS in Southampton and to be perfectly honest I wouldn't have given them £2.50 for it, it had been dropped and was in the tattiest condition I've ever seen, looked like someone had been on an off road adventure just prior to it being parked up. We then went over to Poole and saw another and took it out for a test ride. Verdict - not too bad - although it certainly needs a lowering kit for me to be perfectly comfortable with it. Certainly doesn't have the gruntish sound of my little Ollie but one can always change the can to get that effect. So I'm certainly not discounting it yet.....
The SV650 is way too high and even with a lowering kit and a modified seat I don't think I'll manage to get these little legs firmly on the floor.
kj
Maybe try a CB500? It's a nicer bike than the GS.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
Will second the quality of the CB500... my dad rides one, he looked at the GS, Diversion etc... The CB was the best by miles. Rides well, is very comfortable and is very well built.
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Re: Bike cutting out - Any ideas?
I must say I had a CB500 and loved it to bits was good little alrounder and mpg was good on it too.