View Full Version : Sleeping in my van?
redken1
21-11-10, 09:13 AM
I am attending the WB Xmas party next month and want to consume a few beers (Liam informs me that the coffee machine is out of action on that night. lol). Obviously I will be unable to drive, so I was considering sleeping in my van if I cannot arrange a lift home. Does anyone know how I stand with regards to the law?
Illegal. Had 3 guys call my work, all with DR10s who got done when parked up on the side of the road - sleeping off there drink.
Though it would take one hell of a picky cop to do you. Might cause some suspicion though.
You do hear of Plod being funny over this, however, I think a lot depends upon the officer, your attitude to them an dprobably the van. If you are in a camper van then surely thats less suspicious than a transit.
Of course if you havent got the ignition key that would help tremendously
Don't do it. A mate of mine got done for exactly that a few years ago.
He had no intention of driving, just wanted to kip in the back of this car. The Police caught him as he was unlocking his car. I forget the terminology of his conviction.
I suppose one way out if you find someone sober (good luck) to unlock the van for you which shows you have no intention to drive.
wiltshire builders
21-11-10, 07:36 PM
Don't do it. A mate of mine got done for exactly that a few years ago.
He had no intention of driving, just wanted to kip in the back of this car. The Police caught him as he was unlocking his car. I forget the terminology of his conviction.
I suppose one way out if you find someone sober (good luck) to unlock the van for you which shows you have no intention to drive.
Drunk while incharge of a vehicle. Bit of a vague conviction but a conviction none-the-less. I sleep in my van when I go surfing and often have a few beers. Technically I'm breaking the law.
What if you get someone to lock you in and leave the keys somewhere? If you don't have the keys could you still be done?
Green Man
21-11-10, 07:46 PM
Redken1 why sleep in the van it is a hotel im sure basil can sort something out for you then you can drink as much as you wont and Fall over as many times as you like
PS I have a sofa if you get stuck if that’s ok for you
[smiley=beer.gif] [smiley=beer.gif] [smiley=beer.gif] [smiley=beer.gif]
Surely this would only a be a problem if you were parked on the road and not on private property?.
I think if you leave the keys on one of the wheels you might get away with it because the keys won't be on your person. The other thing to consider is could you still be over the limit in the morning?
I'm coming to the Christmas meal (have booked an early escape from work!) I'll be driving so if you are on the way to T'bridge from Swindon I'll pick you up and drop you off if you like.
a friend of my daughters was arrested for sleeping in his car after a night out on the drink,he slept in his car as he had lost his front door key and didnt want to wake the house up,i do believe he was let off in the end as he had not been driving the car it was parked on the public highway though ;) I would have thought if you were parked on private land and left your keys with the landlord there would not be a problem [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
redken1
21-11-10, 08:55 PM
Redken1 why sleep in the van it is a hotel im sure basil can sort something out for you then you can drink as much as you wont and Fall over as many times as you like
PS I have a sofa if you get stuck if that’s ok for you
[smiley=beer.gif] [smiley=beer.gif] [smiley=beer.gif] [smiley=beer.gif]
Think I have arranged a lift home, It was just a thought as a last resort, but from the comments sounds a bit risky any way. Like you say I could book a room in the hotel subject to vacancies. Thanks for your offer Colin you are a top star mate. :) Thanks all
DaytonaDog
21-11-10, 10:01 PM
I know you have found a solution for the xmas do, but I thought I'd post this up for the benefit of others so that they don't become a cropper. I apologise in advance if it becomes long-winded.
Wiltshire Builder was correct in stating that the offence committed is 'Being in charge of a motor vehicle while over the prescribed limit - Road Traffic Act 1988, s 5(1)(b).
It is triable summarily, maximum sentence of three months imprisonment and/or fine and discretionary disqualification (Driving whilst over the prescribed limit carries a mandatory disqualification).
The Act states
If a person
is in charge of a motor vehicle on a road or other public place, after consuming so much alcohol that the proportion of it in his breath, blood or urine exceeds the prescribed limit he is guilty of an offence.
In essence there are two elements to the offence, (1) being in charge of a motor vehicle and (2) being over the prescribed limit.
So what does being in charge constitute. In basic terms a person is essentially in charge of a motor vehicle whilst they have the keys in their possession. Technically this means that I can still be in charge of my vehicle even if it is parked up in a car park, and I am at home fast asleep, provided I have the keys.
To cover this technicality a lawful defence has been entered into the legislation that states
(2) It is a defence for a person charged with an offence to prove that at the time he is alleged to have committed the offence the circumstances were such that there was no likelihood of his driving the vehicle whilst the proportion of alcohol in his breath, blood or urine remained likely to exceed the prescribed limit.
Hopefully the following two scenarios will help explain.
Scenario 1.
You have driven you car into town, parked it up in a public car park, had a good night out and are well over the drink drive limit. You can't get home so decide to sleep in your car. It is a cold night so start the engine in order to warm up your heater. Therefore the keys are in the ignition, the engine is running and you are in the vehicle, and as such there is a likelihood that the vehicle may be driven (It doesn't matter that your intention is not to drive, there is a possibility that you may change your mind and drive)
Now take the same scenario, but after getting into the car you give your keys to somebody else for safekeeping. thus preventing you from starting up the car and there being no likelihood of the vehicle being driven.
It is for the defendant to prove on the balance of probabilities that there was no likelihood of his driving the vehicle. Once that defence is raised it is then for the prosecution to prove beyond reasonable doubt that there was a likelihood of the vehicle being driven.
I once came across a car that was parked at a funny angle across a couple of parking bays, a male was sat in the drivers seat, he had his seat belt on, the engine was running, the radio was on, the driver was fast asleep and his feet were on the pedals. He was woken up and subsequently provided a positive breath sample. Because I had not seen him actually driving the vehicle, he was charged with being in charge of a motor vehicle whilst over the prescribed limit because there was clearly a likelihood of the vehicle being driven.
In summary the best advice I can give is to avoid sleeping in your car after drinking unless absolutely necessary and if possible give your keys to somebody else to look after and never ever turn the engine on.
As a final note and to put your minds at rest, it is not something that crops up very often these days. In fourteen years I have arrested two people for the offence, one is the one highlighted above, the other didn't get charged as he could prove that he had no intention of driving the vehicle.
Sorry this is very long winded and full of legal stuff but I would hate for you guys to fall foul of this law, despite having the best of intentions.
[smiley=thumbsup.gif] [smiley=thumbsup.gif] [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
or just stick to coke ... ;D
redken1
21-11-10, 11:26 PM
Thanks Chris for taking the time to clarify the legal position. If I have a few beers I will not be sleeping in the van. Thanks for the advice Roxy, but I always drink tea or coffee at bike meets - wanna let my hair down (not much to let down I know. lol) at the Xmas party. Thanks again all, but i'm sorted for a lift home now. Still helpful to know where I stand for future refernce tho.
Don't do it. A mate of mine got done for exactly that a few years ago.
He had no intention of driving, just wanted to kip in the back of this car. The Police caught him as he was unlocking his car. I forget the terminology of his conviction.
I suppose one way out if you find someone sober (good luck) to unlock the van for you which shows you have no intention to drive.
Drunk while incharge of a vehicle. Bit of a vague conviction but a conviction none-the-less. I sleep in my van when I go surfing and often have a few beers. Technically I'm breaking the law.
What if you get someone to lock you in and leave the keys somewhere? If you don't have the keys could you still be done?
Absolutly. You can be done for being in the van with the keys. A friend of mine got had that way. He had returned to the car to get his phone and got nicked. One year ban and a hefty fine. They only have to insinuate the intention to drive....
Not worth the risk if you ask me.
or just stick to coke ... ;D
Thats a totally different story ;)
I think if you leave the keys on one of the wheels you might get away with it because the keys won't be on your person. The other thing to consider is could you still be over the limit in the morning?
I'm coming to the Christmas meal (have booked an early escape from work!) I'll be driving so if you are on the way to T'bridge from Swindon I'll pick you up and drop you off if you like.
Hey Jackie - any chance for a lift too? :) :-* :) You can stay at mine after if you don't fancy drive back to Swindon that late [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
I think if you leave the keys on one of the wheels you might get away with it because the keys won't be on your person. The other thing to consider is could you still be over the limit in the morning?
I'm coming to the Christmas meal (have booked an early escape from work!) I'll be driving so if you are on the way to T'bridge from Swindon I'll pick you up and drop you off if you like.
Hey Jackie - any chance for a lift too? :) :-* :) You can stay at mine after if you don't fancy drive back to Swindon that late [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
Are we talking about the WB Xmas Meal at the Sally in January or the WB Polebarn Christmas buffet? I'm confused :-? Jackie - if it's the PB one you are talking about - get drunk and stay at mine - staggering distance!!! ;D
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