View Full Version : A terrible accident or rough justice???
BladeTriple
10-09-10, 05:51 PM
http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/News/newsresults/General-news/2010/September/sep1010-helmet-less-theft-suspect-killed/
The decision is yours.... I've already made my mind up on this one !
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Nope glad he's dead and hope he suffered dying too - thieving scum deserves no sympathy from me.
Im sorry but I still think its a waste of a life... he probably still has parents, siblings maybe his own children who will be devastated at his death...... no death of another human being should be celebrated!!
BladeTriple
10-09-10, 06:08 PM
interesting 2 very differing contrasting attitudes so far , nobody deserves to die but again was this person tempting fate by acting so irresponsibly? , even a bike thief should have some sense to wear a helmet knowing damn well that police etc will give some level of chase :(
Bonnielass
10-09-10, 06:16 PM
I'm with Beamer but what an idiot!! (not Beamer!)
Uber Dave
10-09-10, 06:31 PM
Little Sympathy from me for the person who stole the bike. I feel sorry for his family though that he died. But seriously, what was he thinking......
On a side note, what is wrong with our stupid country, H&S has gone mad that the police wouldnt pursue them! If they stole it they should be chased regardless of if they had helmets or if its too dangerous. If they dont want to be chased and put in more danger, then DON'T STEAL OTHER PEOPLES STUFF!
Please don't get me wrong I feel the sympathy for the family but people like that I don't care about - same as rapists, murderers and anyone else that abuses the privaledge of life or makes others a misery
Bike Thieves? **** 'em... those that don't kill themselves by riding like twats should be summarily executed when caught... at least they will be when the Voice of Reason Party runs the country >:( I have no time whatsoever for thieving scum, I've worked hard for everything that I have so what gives some low-life the right to walk off with it just because they feel like it? The bleeding heart social workers and the like can stuff their "social deprivation" and "didn't have enough teddy bears as a child" bollocks - thieves are lazy and greedy and as far as I'm concerned, when they cross the line and start nicking peoples' stuff, they forfeit all their rights.
Oh, and another thing......
totally agree Scotty, cut their bollocks off as well!! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
Totally with you Scotty - grew up in little better that an orphanage myself - everything i have i worked for - and damn hard.
If anyone nicks my bike they'd probably better off in a quick accident than when i got hold of them!!!
The stupid prats think riding a bike is simple - no need to learn - no need to wear protective gear - no need to respect anyone or anything - after all everything is their right and they think they are immortal.
Sadly we see far more of that attitude these days - when I was a boy......................yawn
Feel sorry for his family etc never nice losing a son or brother BUT if i went riding without a helmet i would expect to be killed if i came off.
Also there is an old saying. Play with fire, expect to get burnt. Sorry but he was a theif. End of....
CBRowner
11-09-10, 10:23 AM
I'm in two minds about this one. Yes they stole, but they stole some bikes which are replacable unlike their lives.
I do however think that theiving b**tards should be hung by the tessers for hours on end but I'd never wish a death on anything like that.
Peado's, rapists and murderers on the other hand should be fried >:(
Yes the system is ****..... oh for a perfect world where there isnt all the bad evil stuff...... we are all born the same but end up with different values fed to us throughout our childhood, education system, culture etc etc etc......We all choose which way we go through life and should expect to take the consequences that follow our actions...... but I still would not celebrate another's persons death.
But hey thats just me....... ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
And I am not disagreeing with all your opinions, everyone has the right to say what they think/feel.
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The rule of law must always prevail. There is no justice to anybody in this instance. His family has lost a relative, and the people he stole from have not recieved justice.
wiltshire builders
11-09-10, 03:18 PM
I'm with Jon on this one. His death has caused more problems than it has solved. The van driver, the paramedics, the notifying officer and his family and friends have all been traumatised by this. Plus the bike owner has lost his bike. The tea leaf was clearly thick but will never get to realize it. You may think "Good, one less scum-bag on the street" but in reality everyone loses.
It's sad that someone was driven to steal bikes in the first place...and then I guess by the time you decide to do something that risky it goes hand in hand with not wearing a helmet. A tragic end for all
Bikermouse
11-09-10, 08:36 PM
I'm sitting on the fence. I don't think the justice system is up to much (and I should know! >:() - even if caught he'd end up at Butlins with the big gates, being waited on hand and foot, and then let out to continue his wayward ways. Rehabilitation, my left buttock!!!!
More to the point was the bike ok?
It's sad that someone was driven to steal bikes in the first place...
I'll have to pull you up on a point there Dabz, he was thieving druggie scum, he wasn't driven to steal bikes, nobody made him do it, it was his lifestyle choice, indolent work-shy scumbag - why work for a living when you can claim benefits left, right and centre and then steal other people's stuff to fund your recreational habit? Nothing more than a turd on the lawn of humanity, hope the ****er didn't die instantly.... >:( >:( >:(
Green Man
11-09-10, 10:50 PM
It's sad that someone was driven to steal bikes in the first place...
I'll have to pull you up on a point there Dabz, he was thieving druggie scum, he wasn't driven to steal bikes, nobody made him do it, it was his lifestyle choice, indolent work-shy scumbag - why work for a living when you can claim benefits left, right and centre and then steal other people's stuff to fund your recreational habit? Nothing more than a turd on the lawn of humanity, hope the ****er didn't die instantly.... >:( >:( >:(
+1 As Scotty says scum of the earth, Sorry I don’t do any of this political correctness **** [smiley=huh.gif] [smiley=huh.gif]
Bikermouse
11-09-10, 10:56 PM
More to the point was the bike ok?
I don't think it was >:( >:( >:
Know the feeling ;)
Green Man
11-09-10, 11:04 PM
More to the point was the bike ok?
I don't think it was >:( >:( >:
Know the feeling ;)
Rip for the bike Respect!!
:'( :'(
redken1
12-09-10, 05:53 PM
Bike Thieves? **** 'em... those that don't kill themselves by riding like twats should be summarily executed when caught... at least they will be when the Voice of Reason Party runs the country >:( I have no time whatsoever for thieving scum, I've worked hard for everything that I have so what gives some low-life the right to walk off with it just because they feel like it? The bleeding heart social workers and the like can stuff their "social deprivation" and "didn't have enough teddy bears as a child" bollocks - thieves are lazy and greedy and as far as I'm concerned, when they cross the line and start nicking peoples' stuff, they forfeit all their rights.
Oh, and another thing......
The punishment should always fit the crime. Execution for theft is certainly not the voice of reason Scotty. This is not downtown Kabul.
The punishment should always fit the crime. Execution for theft is certainly not the voice of reason Scotty. This is not downtown Kabul.
Ever heard the expression "tongue in cheek"? ::)
Ever had a bike stolen? I have... >:(
redken1
12-09-10, 10:37 PM
The punishment should always fit the crime. Execution for theft is certainly not the voice of reason Scotty. This is not downtown Kabul.
Ever heard the expression "tongue in cheek"? ::)
Ever had a bike stolen? I have... >:(
Never had a bike stolen but I reckon I would be pretty angry if I had.
I had a bike stolen once.. I reported it to the police... frankly they couldn't give a ****. >:(
I found it 3 days later, abandoned in a field, completely trashed.
Having your bike stolen is soul destroying.. I would have gladly castrated the thieving swine with a blunt spoon!!! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
The problem is that the criminals know about the 'don't chase if they ain't wearing a lid' policy, so they know the police won't chase them. Personally if you steal a vehicle, you have made a choice to do it, and like any other choice you have to accept the consequences for your actions, if you then decide to ride / drive like a moron without a seat belt or lid then, once again you have made a choice, and should accept the consequences, if you die doing it, well tough **** really, no sympathy for you, deserve what you have coming, you made the choice to do it.
Oh and just for the record not every 'druggie' is scum ;D
And not everyone in receipt of benefits is work-shy, and out nicking your bikes to fund their recreational habits. I have never stolen anything to fund any purchases of my drug of choice, in fact the vast majority of users don't, but you will always get a few bad apples that spoil the trip for everyone else, and then we all get tarred with the same brush. On the other hand claiming you have a drug addiction will lessen any sentance you get, so is it a wonder that criminals claim addictions? if you got caught doign something and faced a long stay in one of her majesties hotels, and you knew claiming an addiction would get you a suspended or severly lightened sentence, what would you do?
As a 'druggie' myself I would much rather the law didn't take addiction into consideration when handing out a sentence, sure help the person get clean, but if the crime warrants 2 years, then they get 2 years, no one forced the needle in their arm, or the straw up their nose, they made the choice, the should deal with the consequences, and stop giving the rest of us a bad name!
BladeTriple
13-09-10, 08:02 AM
Oh and just for the record not every 'druggie' is scum
I would much rather the law didn't take addiction into consideration when handing out a sentence, sure help the person get clean, but if the crime warrants 2 years, then they get 2 years, no one forced the needle in their arm, or the straw up their nose, they made the choice, the should deal with the consequences, and stop giving the rest of us a bad name!
I'm sure the wife and collegues of SSgt Chris Chacksfield will appreciate that Hunar, especially as the Semi Pro Boxer who killed him with a single punch after attacking both Chris and his wife Adele as they walked down the street.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/features/3003820/Wifes-grief-after-war-veteran-Chris-Chacksfield-killed-by-punch-on-night-out.html
The w@nker in question claimed he was on cocaine and alcohol when he attacked , from behind this brave soldier who had returned on leave from Afghanistan and his Army nurse wife hitting them both and Chris dying from his injuries. This prick actually used the drugs as a defence for his behaviour basically saying had he not been on drugs and booze he wouldn't have done it ....
So nope Judges shouldn't take their addiction into account when they sentence but I hope the bastard that killed Chacks does his full 5 years for MURDER and gets arse raped and battered every night in jail for his evil doings.... along with getting the drug therapy he so badly needs .... TOSSER!
Sorry Stu, any drug be it alcohol or 'recreational' if abused is bad.... No not everyone takes it to extremes but being a user itself isn't an excuse for being a C**T!
Sorry Stu, any drug be it alcohol or 'recreational' if abused is bad.... No not everyone takes it to extremes but being a user itself isn't an excuse for being a C**T!
I was just thinking when the hell did I bring drugs into this!! Forgot Hunars name is Stu as well lol (note to self must stop taking the smack before reading lol)
i agree the courts should not take drug history into account and some state in the US if your caught as a user of meth, coke and Heroin you automatically get 90 days lock up for rehab then face your punishment for the crime.
there is a smack dealer round the corner from me but he ensures that they don't steal etc (yeah i know a dealer with a conscience!) But I'd rather he'd be there as if he went it'll soon be replaced with someone else who prob doesn't have any care and the cars, houses etc will start getting broken into
redken1
13-09-10, 06:53 PM
The problem is that the criminals know about the 'don't chase if they ain't wearing a lid' policy, so they know the police won't chase them. Personally if you steal a vehicle, you have made a choice to do it, and like any other choice you have to accept the consequences for your actions, if you then decide to ride / drive like a moron without a seat belt or lid then, once again you have made a choice, and should accept the consequences, if you die doing it, well tough **** really, no sympathy for you, deserve what you have coming, you made the choice to do it.
With respect Hunar I don't think its quite as simple as that. The problem is that when the poice take the decision to engage in a high speed pursuit It's not only the suspect and the officers themselves who are put at risk, but the general public too. Although I do not have the statistics at hand, the number of innocent by-standers who are either killed or seriously injured during such pursuits is on the increase. In some instances, the suspects are wanted for minor offences.
Richzx10r
13-09-10, 07:41 PM
Like many have said already,the justice system(term used loosly)is a joke.If there is very little consiquence for your crime(if your caught that is)then the risk is worth it.
As far as celebrating a death.No,not for me.But,i sure as hell wont shed a tear.
Very interesting reading eveybodys response to this topic.Certain responses really did get me thinking.I mean that in a good way to.Its interesting reading others points of views and opening your mind a bit.
redken1
13-09-10, 09:34 PM
Richzx10r you are spot on-this topic has certainly stirred the emotions. When I lived in a small village in Scotland where everyone Knew everyone, a 10 year old boy was watching me cutting logs with a chainsaw outside my house. I went in for tea, put the saw in the garage without locking it. Came out an hour later and the boy had entered the garage and stolen it. After the anger subsided I gave it some thought as to why the child might have turned to stealing. His father had a drink problem,used to knock his mother about and had been inside numerous times. The boy's father was a woodcutter. I did'nt blame the boy because he was raised believing that violence and theft were the norm and acceptable. He obviously wanted to please his father. I felt sorry for that boy because no child should have to go through what he did.Somehow as a society we need to break the cycle.
Richzx10r you are spot on-this topic has certainly stirred the emotions. When I lived in a small village in Scotland where everyone Knew everyone, a 10 year old boy was watching me cutting logs with a chainsaw outside my house. I went in for tea, put the saw in the garage without locking it. Came out an hour later and the boy had entered the garage and stolen it. After the anger subsided I gave it some thought as to why the child might have turned to stealing. His father had a drink problem,used to knock his mother about and had been inside numerous times. The boy's father was a woodcutter. I did'nt blame the boy because he was raised believing that violence and theft were the norm and acceptable. He obviously wanted to please his father. I felt sorry for that boy because no child should have to go through what he did.Somehow as a society we need to break the cycle.
my point exactly......we are all born the same.....we learn what we are taught......and that is in a variety of ways...as we get older we are expected to make judgements and decisions on the information we are given from birth, if that information isnt given out carefully then it can get misconscrued, misunderstood or if it just plain wasnt there in the first place then its going to be a problem ...I am not one of the do-gooders who think people should 'get off lightly' and in this particular case the thief didnt get of lightly, he died..........But in every single case of people doing wrong there are completely different factors, reasons and explainations.......it's all very well us sat here exploding with anger at a 'simple' case of theft...... but without all the facts who are we to be judge and jury??...... there is only one judge (in my eyes) and the 'case' was dealt with!!!!!
And I still wont celebrate anothers death
Really good reading others thoughts and points of view tho....thanx for sharing 'cos it's been really interesting [smiley=thumbsup.gif] [smiley=thumbsup.gif] [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
Hunar, sorry you got the impression that I condemn all users of herbal recreation - not so, I have nothing against people having a spliff or two, there are many more harmful substances around, but people like yourself don't steal and rob as a way of life to get their kicks and pay for their next fix. The criminal scum of this country know that the law are powerless to do anything about them and their activities most of the time - you only have to watch some of the many fly-on-the-wall cop programmes on TV nowadays to hear the gobby ****s mouthing off at the cops with virtual impunity - I long for a step back to the good old days and more policing Ã* la Gene Hunt and Jack Regan.... "Shut it you slag!" *WHACK*
Uber Dave
14-09-10, 06:12 PM
I long for a step back to the good old days and more policing Ã* la Gene Hunt and Jack Regan.... "Shut it you slag!" *WHACK*
I am with you on that one. If kids had something to be scared of by the police then they wouldnt mouth of at them for the fear of getting a kicking and been sent on their way. Same with adults, they know the law protects them regardless so they think they can do what they want. Huntly claiming compensation from the prison service is one example which winds me up.
wiltshire builders
15-09-10, 06:07 PM
I long for a step back to the good old days and more policing Ã* la Gene Hunt and Jack Regan.... "Shut it you slag!" *WHACK*
I am with you on that one. If kids had something to be scared of by the police then they wouldnt mouth of at them for the fear of getting a kicking and been sent on their way. Same with adults, they know the law protects them regardless so they think they can do what they want. Huntly claiming compensation from the prison service is one example which winds me up.
What like desk sergeant Mark Andrews? Where do you draw the line?
I know a country that dishes out on the spot beatings and the powers that be don't have to answer to anyone. A few of my mates are there at the moment.
Stiffer sentences "Yes" but lets keep a level head.
DaytonaDog
15-09-10, 07:50 PM
I am going to put my head above the parapet here, as I am a serving police officer (not traffic I hasten to add). (Ducks insults and mudslinging)!!!!
I have been in the police for 14 years, all of which have been in uniform on a response team and I am currently an immediate response driver, so I feel I am speaking from a position of experience.
I have read all the posts and it is interesting to note the differing opinions of all on here.
My reason for posting is to explain the rationale behind why the police do not pursue motorcycles and on occasions (quite often) cars. Before I do I will give my own view on wether it is a terrible accident or rough justice. I, like most, would never ever wish for a loss of life, no matter what the history of the person concerned maybe, however, this male made a decision of his own free will, and decided to take the risks he did and he suffered the consequences of taking those risks. Fortunately, on this occasion he did not take anybody with him which is often the case. Nobody forced him to steal the bike and nobody forced him to not wear a helmet, so I personally will not lose any sleep over this persons death.
Now onto the reason for my post, namely, why the police do not pursue. I could write reams and reams as to why the police do not pursue vehicles, but in summary it boils down to The Human Rights Act, in particular the Article covering a right to life, the first principle of policing, namely preservation of life and limb and a prospency to being risk averse and worrying about what the media and public will perceive. Essentially, any action the police take these days has to be proportionate and justified, i.e. you shouldn't use a sledgehammer to crack a nut, and in this case is it worth risking a persons life for a 10,000 pound piece of metal, or is the offence committed worth it, do we know the identity of the offender etc etc.
Personally as a front line officer, trained to pursue vehicles that fail to stop, it boils my piss, when I get stood down from a pursuit, however I could not live with myself, if in continuing a pursuit I was responsible for the loss of an innocent member of publics life who happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time and I tell myself the scrote will come again.
Yes the scrotes are fully aware of this policy, hence the reason they will fail to stop, in the hope that the pursuit is stood down, and mostly they do, but they do get caught eventually. The problem is once they are caught that the sentence they then get from the courts is a joke and serve as no deterrent whatsoever.
virginie_morisot
15-09-10, 08:49 PM
agree wih Daytona here , with the view that luckily no innocent lifes were taken or damaged.. obviously he commited a crime and did something very stupid not wearing a helmet but i can't celebrate such a stupid waste of a life. obviously this may leave behind a lot of pain with relatives and friends. and yes of course the decsion whether whatever can ge gained form making a pursuit outweighs the risks for lives should be left with whoever is competent to make that decision..when i drive or ride around I'm glad not to be caught in middle of hollywood style car chase, in big scheme of things whatever it cost is not worth someone's life.
stupid and tragic ending, at least no others were hurt..
Uber Dave
15-09-10, 09:06 PM
I long for a step back to the good old days and more policing Ã* la Gene Hunt and Jack Regan.... "Shut it you slag!" *WHACK*
I am with you on that one. If kids had something to be scared of by the police then they wouldnt mouth of at them for the fear of getting a kicking and been sent on their way. Same with adults, they know the law protects them regardless so they think they can do what they want. Huntly claiming compensation from the prison service is one example which winds me up.
I know a country that dishes out on the spot beatings and the powers that be don't have to answer to anyone. A few of my mates are there at the moment.
You dont have to tell me about that, I spent my share of time in that very same country in 2008.
I was not implying that level of "discipline" should be adopted here I was trying to make the point that there is no fear factor to the law any more, be that of the Police on the street or of the justice system as a whole. The punishment for committing a crime is meant to act as a deterrent for doing it in the first place and our justice system is anything but that currently.
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